Fic I Have No Plot For But Desperately Want The Character Dynamics In: Preboot Era Helena Bertinelli,

(TRIGGER WARNING FOR SA, KIDNAPPING, AND UNALIVING YOURSELF)

Okay I loved Circe but HATED how they made Odysseus out as some kind of villain and not a victim.

Sure, he did terrible things, but it was all to get back to his family. He technically ‘cheated’ but if he didn’t then he would have probably been killed.

I’ve only read Circe and watched Epic so far, I’m reading the Greek Odyssey tomorrow when it comes, but in Epic he doesn’t cheat.

I haven’t read that part of Circe in a while because I took a break, but I’m pretty sure she made him sleep with her, not outright forcefully but it was heavily implied he and his men would die if he didn’t (if I remember correctly). She was way more powerful than him and the roots could only hold up against her for so long, he barely had a choice, so it was technically consensual, but it was still barely his choice.

Calypso trapped him on her island for seven years, I heard he cried for his family every night, and in Epic (maybe also the Odyssey) he wanted to unalive himself. It was also very similar to Circe, where she was much more powerful than him, and this time he had no help or defense, even if for a limited time, it came only when he escaped. He had no where to go, a goddess who was in love with him and had never seen another living person before, he was defenseless. I don’t know if that was technically consensual or if she forced him but he still had little to no choice if he did say yes.

Many forget he is a victim because he is a man or haven’t read the Odyssey, but that doesn’t mean it didn’t happen, he may have done horrible things but for a reason, for many people who do those things don’t have.

I agree he probably changed and was more guarded/on edge, but from what I’ve seen and read, I don’t think he would call his son a traitor. He loves his wife, and talks about her more in Epic, but he still longs to know him. I don’t think what Telemachus did would make him not want to form a relationship and try to know him. Because that is his son who he’s longed to know for 20 years, I think only strong evidence that he was a traitor would make him act that way at all.

I also didn’t like how Penelope told Circe the act to try and get out of war was fake. Sure, he is a genius, a master manipulator, even left his bow behind when he is a great archer to become the Best of the Greeks. He cares about his title and legacy. But he spent 10 years trying to get back to his wife and son.

In Epic he sacrificed his friend’s lives, he turned into the monster he feared he would become, he even made Poseidon call him a monster.

He could have spent the rest of his life with Calypso in ‘paradise’ but he was miserable there, wanting to see his family, wanting to be with his people.

Anyways, I thought most parts of the book were great, I may be a little bit biased because I love Odysseus and can’t wait for my Greek Odyssey to come, but I think I made some strong arguments.

Thanks if you made it this far. Also, is the Song of Achilles worth it if I like Odysseus this much but people say he’s not a good person in it? Please comment your thoughts!

I've had a DC x DP prompt/fic idea and I'd thought I'd share.

Danny, who has been dragged into taken over the role of High King, has been going through some of the paperwork that it entails. Of course, he's still baby ghost so CW and the others actually help with most the stuff, but he had some free time after being chased out of his house and injured (it'd been a few months since then).

Either way, he finds a particular line of complaints. He was never one to engage in it, but many of his subject, of which fall under the demon category, are complaining about a soul they can't collect. Danny personally finds it kind of funny. He sets those ones aside for now though, and continues doing whatever.

A few months later, he's summoned via some magic user, probably Klarion, and is now in front of the JL and a tiny wayward chaos maker. In a more eldritch form, he turns to Klarion, who very clearly did not mean to summon him specifically by the way he's panicking and called Teekel back, and just tells him he's grounded.

Thinking thatbwas that after Klarion left, he went back to his castle to do more work...and maybe play with Cujo. Really, Pariah Dark left so much paperwork, he doesn't wanna do all that!

The JL however is now steadfast on finding whatever the fuck that was. Klarion was scared of it, and it seemed more annoyed at being called than concerned about the heroes behind it. So that could be very very bad news.

Danny, after a while, realizes the JL is trying to find out more about him, which makes his life very difficult, fuck you very much, has a wonderfully stupid idea.

Going back to those papers about the soul that can't be collected, he summons a very tired and now spooked british man. One by the name of John Constantine. He wants a deal. More specifically, whatever deals he'd made, those were now the High Kings, and in return for whatever he got out of the deals, he wanted John to help him. All in all, he just got hired by the High King in return for ignoring the equivalent of taxes.

John was very confused, but hey, boy king of there is very chill out of formal settings. And also maybe he's worried about the fact that like a 16 year old is king-

Either way, there deal goes a little something along the lines of;

Danny: Keep the JL off my back, and all your debts are no longer valid and anyone that disagrees can come fight me.

John: ....okay??????

So while Danny got a "I don't wanna deal with this hero!" guy, John got a "I don't wanna deal with this demon!" guy.

So, I was thinking about Cass and Shiva, and I remembered the time when Cass became a villain. If Shiva appeared during the stories of that time, how do you think she would react? I imagine she would be extremely pissed and murderous towards the ones that forced Cass to act against her will.

Yeah, you nailed it. I think Shiva should always respect Cass walking her own path, becoming her own woman and finding her own strength. But I also think that should come with a certain degree of weird, messy protectiveness.

Shiva seeing Cass letting herself stray from her path should piss her off, not least of which because she knows that it can only result in a weaker, brittle, lesser version of her daughter. She knows how strong Cass can be when she's at one with herself and how weak she is when she's not, and she should rightfully think that's a waste. It should greatly upset her to see Cass holding herself back.

And Shiva seeing Cass being forcibly led astray, brainwashed into being someone else's lackey, turned into something she's not by the machinations of weaker, jealous men...

There should be blood. Rivers of them.

One of my favorite sub genres is Asian assassins with questionable morals

And that's why we love her

One time the bat kids hung out in the cave while B was at a JL meeting. The whole place was covered in pink glitter and silly string by the time they were done. The only person who didn’t have glitter on them was Cassandra, no one knows how.

They don’t even try to clean it and just fr owned it.

Bruce comes back with the JL in tow to a pink, sparkly batcave and almost has an aneurism.

Oliver and Dinah is laughing their asses off and the JL is shocked.

Oliver; remind me to get them Prada for Christmas.

Bruce;…

Nightwing, Red Hood, Red Robin, Robin, Spoiler, Black Bat, and Signal chose that moment to reenter the room.

Oliver; good job!

Hood; thanks uncle arrow!

Hal; what’s wrong with B?

Signal; wait for it.

Bruce; THE BATMOBILE TOO!?!

I have been reading a lot of headcanons of the justice league, my favorites are when batman reveals his identity but only to....Green arrow

It's so fun because imagine if for any reason Batman is forced to reveal his identity and everyone thinks he will choose Superman or/and Wonderwoman (because you know THE trinity, the dream team) BUT NO, he chooses green arrow

at this point the justice league already put aside whatever they were doing and start questioning batman, that is to say without hate towards Ollie but he is not the most secretive, nor the most competent, I mean HE IS NOT EVEN THE CLOSEST TO BATMAN, so yes, even Oliver is wondering why him?

and then without anything else Batman does or says some kind of code, at that moment everyone thinks that he must have already lost his mind when they hear the BIGGEST gasp from none other than Green Arrow, now he is running to hug Batman jumping and holding on like a koala while screaming

"WHY YOU NEVER SAID IT BEFORE SILLY"

"so you understand?"

"OF COURSE I UNDERSTAND IT'S OUR SUPER SECRET SUPER BEST FRIENDS CODE"

That's when J'onn leaves the room because he's not going to deal with the nonsense that these supposed heroes are thinking, the earth is doomed with these fools

Flash is screaming terrified that someone replaced Batman and brainwashed Ollie

Aquaman and Captain Marvel are pretending to know whatever is going on because they totally didn't sleep for half of the meeting

Black Canary's eyes are so wide and she looks like she had an epiphany from something Ollie said

Green Lantern still doesn't get over the fact that Batman is revealing his identity? (of course in such a weird way that only one of them understands, fuck him) but at the end of the day revealing his identity?

Wonder Woman and Superman are having a crisis and they are GREEN with envy, because not only did Batman reveal his identity to Green Arrow of all people, but he is also HUGGING him (also, they are the Bat's best friends, thank you very much)

Then Oliver, oblivious to everything, finishes by saying

"Wait, this means I kissed THE KNIGHT OF GOTHAM, THE BATMAN?, wow B you are killing me"

everyone explodes

totally based on this amazing post

Jason: Go kill them. Problem solved.

Oliver: You can't just go around killing people Jason.

Jason: I know. That's why you should do it.

Oliver: No, no. I can't go around killing people, either. Bruce will be mad with me.

Bruce: *eyes twich*

cain and bruce and cass are sooo interesting to me... long rambles (with comic panel receipts!) under the cut (also batgirl 2000 spoilers)

Cain had tried many times before to make The One Who Is All, but Cassandra is special in a way the others weren't because she worked. She didn't defy instructions, she was amazing at combat, she didn't go insane, she was perfect. And David grew to love her in a way he hadn't loved the others, even though he hurt her, because it was the price he had to pay to get his little girl perfect. Yes he shot her, but it was to keep her on her toes, and she had to be that to be perfect - it’s the price he has to pay. He rarely touched her, because it was a price he had to pay, but in the times that he did, he cuddled with her on the rooftop and pointed to the stars. He couldn't talk to her, because it was a price he had to pay, but he could make their own little language and keep her progress on tapes.

And when the time came for her first real foray into being The One Who is All, he dresses her up in a frilly pink dress and pigtails.

And she runs away and David doesn't know what to do. The first kill is always hard, he made her do it too soon, too young, she wasn’t ready, he knows it’s his fault.

And then, years later, when his baby girl is almost an adult (but really he'll always see her as that little girl with pigtails and a bloody pink dress on), he meets her again and she yells at him to stop.

And he cries, because it was the price he had to pay, but his daughter can understand him now, fully, and she's using it to ask him to stop, so how can he say no to that? Now they're dangling over an edge and he's pleading for her to hold on but she can't, she won't, and she survives anyway like she always will but she survives in a cape and ears and a bat across her chest.

David thought that Bruce was perfect when they were training, but he wasn't. He wouldn't kill. But maybe he can be good enough for David's perfect little girl anyway because she won’t either, and god knows David isn't perfect. So he concocts a test, and tries his damndest to keep those tapes of his daughter because that's all he has left of her.

David loves Cass with all of his heart, but his heart isn't big enough to fit things like hugs and speaking and care. The biggest problem is that he sees her as a weapon first, no matter what.

Bruce isn't like that. Cassandra isn't a weapon— she's a bat, of course, she’s perfect for it! And to be the bat, yeah, you have to make sacrifices sometimes. Keeping your identity a secret is much easier when you have no (legal, public) identity to speak of, and he doesn’t understand when Barbara insists on frivolous things like vacations, identities, names, and peace. Why call the girl Cass when she can simply be Batgirl?

If Bruce had a choice, he would just be the bat. And so this girl who is just like him— better, even! Well, of course she’d agree. Yes, she’s young, she’s just seventeen, but… come on. You can barely say a perfect soldier like her is a kid, still. And it’s tragic that Cain made her like this, made her like them, but… it happened. She is like this. So why wouldn’t he help her use it for good? 

He never had to teach Batgirl, this girl who is just like him, about the value of life. Her hits are perfect and measured, to knock them out and nothing more. The first thing he noticed about her was her willingness to die and insistence that no one else does, and he encourages these things. 

And her death wish is ineffective and annoying and dangerous, but it’s inescapable and she doesn’t let it affect her missions anymore.

Batman asks Batgirl if the dozens of lives saved because of what she did is enough. She says no, and he says good. 

When Batgirl loses some of her skills, she runs at an armed man and gets shot 4 times (one in each thigh, one through her shoulder, one in her stomach). But she survives anyway, like she always will, and when she wakes up Batman asked why she did it. She responds instinct. He says, “Good.”

Then he finds out about her upcoming fight with Shiva. Batgirl knows that she will lose. This is not a competition or arrogance for her— this is suicide. She needs to move past this death wish and… well. She might not move… past it, per se, but she will be rid of it, and perhaps the world will become of rid of her. But it’s necessary. So he lets her leave, because he knows she needs to do this. At least she will die with honor.

Later, when she survives even after dying, because she always survives, Batman needs to do something. Something dangerous and reckless and, maybe, a bit suicidal. Batgirl wants to help but he just says “I let you fight Shiva because it was something you had to do for yourself. Don’t say thank you. Return the favor.” 

The tragedy of Batman and Batgirl is unlike the tragedy of David Cain and The One Who Is All, where she is only an assassin to her father— not even that, just a killing weapon. It’s unlike the tragedy of Cassandra and Sandra, where she is just a pawn for her mother’s suicide. And it is especially unlike the tragedy of Babs and Cassie, where she is seen by her mom as so much less than she is, as something that she can never be— regular. Normal. Innocent.

No, the tragedy of Batman and Batgirl is that her dad sees Cassandra as, yes, eventually a daughter, certainly a soldier, but most of all, an extension of himself. And he does not treat himself very well, or with much caution, or with any gentleness.

Constantine’s Kids