How Do You View Albus’ And Severus’ Relationship? Do You Think Albus’ Genuinely Cared For Severus’

How do you view Albus’ and Severus’ relationship? Do you think Albus’ genuinely cared for Severus’ or was he just - using him?

(Once again, disclaimer that I am working from memory and don’t have the books on hand to double-check the details.)

Anon, thank you so much for asking, because this relationship is an absolute goldmine. My tl;dr is “it’s a mess and I love that”.

To start with though, I need to address the framing of your question. Because “genuinely cared” and “using” are not mutually exclusive categories, especially when it comes to Albus. Albus cares about people, just in general. He can be clumsy about showing it when it’s too much for him, or when he’s conflicted, or when he thinks he needs to hold back, but he undoubtedly cares. I don’t say this often because I’m a big believer in the subjectivity of interpreting literature, but - any interpretation that says he doesn’t is wrong, and probably deliberately misreading out of spite. (Am I being uncharitable here? Maybe. But I’m tired of reading some people’s takes so I’m going to be uncharitable.)

People are Albus’ greatest strength and he wins their loyalty not by manipulating them into following him but by genuinely caring about and understanding them. But he also knows what needs to be done, and is capable of distancing himself, and prefers to keep his cards very close to his chest - because he might care for people but he doesn’t trust them. A lot of what gets deemed manipulative or “using” from him stems from his desire to take sole responsibility for things, and unwillingness to let other people in. He’s warm to people but shuts down emotionally when it’s too much or he’s conflicted. He’s never actually been the cold chessmaster fandom likes to paint him as. (Chessmaster? Yes. Cold? No.)

When Severus first approaches him, he’s quite harsh with him. But at this point, as far as Albus knows, Severus is a Death Eater who’s only interest is protecting Lily. (I firmly disagree with the interpretation that Lily is the only reason Severus ever did anything good, but she was his main concern at that time). His harshness doesn’t show that he sees Severus as a tool to me, but quite the opposite - that he sees him as a person capable of growth, wants to see him grow and holds him to that standard. If he were a discardable tool, Albus would have just told him what he wanted to hear in order to win his loyalty. Instead he gives him what he needs - an anchor he can use to pull himself up. Albus places himself as a figure that can offer Severus forgiveness and absolution, and there’s definitely a power imbalance there, and Severus probably resents it quite a bit, but he still latches on to it. Albus and Lily are probably the only two people in his life at that time who’ve ever seen him as someone worth expecting something from.

I don’t think, at this point, that it’s personal for Albus. I doubt he would turn away any Death Eater who genuinely wanted to change, and he is aware of the massive advantage that having a potential spy on his side would offer. He cares, but he’s also in the middle of a war and has other people to protect who take priority. You could say he’s using Severus to an extent - Severus is emotionally vulnerable and desperate, and Albus sees that and knows how to make use of it. A part of him is aware that he needs to use Severus and tries to keep an emotional distance. But his “making use of it” isn’t so much calculated manipulation as offering Severus a way out, which Severus chooses to take.

Albus and Severus make excellent foils that both mirror and contrast each other. Albus plays the role of the hero (I say plays not because I don’t consider him genuinely heroic but because it’s a role he deliberately assumes for others even when he thinks he doesn’t deserve it) because people need him to look up to, but also because it’s hard to shatter the image others have of him. Severus plays the role of a villain out of practical necessity as a spy, but also because he’s so used to it that it’s easier and more comfortable than trying to change people’s perception of him. Both are uncomfortable with emotional vulnerablity or letting people see behind that mask. Both are lonely and isolated and secretive. Both have a lot of guilt bottled up that they don’t talk about. Both are willing to sacrifice themselves to win the war. And both harbour enough self-hatred that they probably strongly dislike seeing themselves reflected.

I wouldn’t be surprised if Albus harbours a touch of envy towards Severus - if only subconsciously - because Severus got to rely on love to redeem himself, which is so far from Albus’ own experience. And Severus almost certainly resents Albus for having seen him emotionally vulnerable and getting to hold the upper hand and remain a distant, unassailable figure. I think a part of each of them senses an emotional rawness in the other that they shy away from because it hits too close to home, so while they may care for each other they have too many rough edges between them to fully like or feel comfortable with one another. That’s a part of why Albus can seem cold and harsh towards Severus; projection and a discomfort with intense emotion that’s too similar to his own. There’s also the fact that he knows Severus is in a precarious position and might have to be sacrificed. There is a slightly mercenary slant to their relationship - both know exactly what they want from the other, and what the other wants from them. And on Albus’ side, I think he feels a certain fragility in his position over Severus - he’s been playing a role that allows him to pass judgement, but he doesn’t feel that role is fully deserved. But he never demands more of Severus than he’d demand of himself - and maybe seeing himself in Severus is what allows him to demand as much of Severus as he does of himself, which is a fairly high, unyielding bar. And this doesn’t preclude emotional attachment to each other, and on Albus’ side, while their similarities may make him want to keep an emotional distance they also, almost paradoxically, allow him to sympathise with and understand Severus.

And with all that, Albus does trust Severus by the end, which is something much rarer for him than simply caring for someone. Severus is the only one who knows the entirety of his plan. Severus is the only one who knows he’s dying. By this point the dynamic of emotional vulnerablity has come full circle and Albus is desperate and forced to show vulnerablity. He hates showing weakness because he’s always been the one that everyone - Severus included - has looked to for strength and certainty, but now he’s willing to beg Severus to kill him. At the start, Severus needed Albus because he had no-one else to rely on. By the end that dynamic is flipped. If there’s one thing I would define their relationship by, it’s “vulnerablity and mutual reliance forced by circumstance” - but I think that circumstance leads to a situation where they understand and trust each other more than anyone else, however uncomfortable it might be for them.

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Why is Count Dooku's characterization vastly different in The Clone Wars then Attack of the Clones? In AOTC he's all like, "I'm sorry old friend" and "Back down", in TCW he seems to take pleasure in killing Jedi. What happened?

Okay, so I lightly touched on this back in this post where I compare the Dooku we see in the Legends continuity to the Dooku we see in Canon and in this video. George Lucas quotes used as sources can be found at the end.

To start with: there's a dichotomy to Dooku.

On the one hand... he makes good points. His concerns are the same that many Jedi share: the Senate is corrupt, and its representatives are abusing their power for their own selfish needs, sometimes even using Jedi to do so.

On the other hand... Dooku's a Sith. Which means he - like the Senators - is also after power, if not moreso. He's greedy, selfish and ambitious. Sure, he makes good points but he’s part of the problem; he knows it, but he doesn’t care.

More importantly, like Maul and Grievous, the primary purpose of Dooku, as a character, is to show us who Anakin is going to turn into:

An evil, corrupted old man. A prodigal son of the Jedi Order (with closet fascist-leanings) who, in his unquenchable thirst for power, was reduced to being a slave of Darth Sidious.

One of the big differences between Dooku and Anakin, however, is that Dooku was always more politically savvy.

Count Dooku has a public image.

He uses his past as a Jedi to cultivate this persona of a wise intellectual, a rational man with fair and just demands, one who fights for the little guy.

He is the head of the Separatist movement, a charismatic figure known throughout the galaxy for his political idealism, even giving lectures at universities.

But it is just a persona.

I mean, that's probably how he started out, sure, but by the time we see him in Attack of the Clones, Dooku is a Sith Lord, and he's been one for over 10 years, because we know he was going by "Tyranus" while ordering Sifo-Dyas' death and hiring Jango Fett a few months before the invasion of Naboo.

QUICK NOTE: In Canon, Dooku left the Jedi Order 10 years before Qui-Gon’s death. So chances are, he's actually been a Sith for almost 20 years, as we know he was already a darksider 8 years prior to The Phantom Menace because he tried to recruit Rael Averross at the end of the book Master & Apprentice.

Which means he's pure evil.

Deep down, Dooku's the guy we see in The Clone Wars: Darth Tyranus, a ruthless, sadistic killer whose only goal is to destroy the Jedi Order and bend the galaxy to his will.

But the galaxy can't know this, right? They think he's Count Dooku, a kind-hearted man whose beliefs are controversial but ultimately altruistic. Hell, even the Jedi remember him fondly.

So, like Palpatine, he keeps up the facade.

He does this with Obi-Wan, as he secretly tries to recruit him to overthrow Sidious (who Lucas compares to Vader trying to do with Luke in Empire Strikes Back):

He does this with the Jedi, calling Mace "old friend", telling him he's sorry he's about to have them executed.

He plays this charade up to the very end...

... but when Obi-Wan still won't back down, he is left with no choice but to kill him the fastest way he can: with a lightsaber.

A red-bladed lightsaber, in signature Sith fashion. One he’s been careful to keep a secret.

But Obi-Wan's seen it, he's seen the Force Lightning... he's been given a peek behind the curtains, so now he has to die.

And you see the change in Dooku’s behavior. He starts to taunt Obi-Wan, he’s grinning, there’s a sadistic glimmer in his eye. For a brief moment, he drops the mask and goes to town.

Oh and Anakin joins in, whatever the more the merrier. But then Yoda joins in... and Dooku can't beat Yoda. Crap, he's gonna tell everyone.

The secret of him being a Sith Lord is gonna get out...!

But this is Palpatine and Dooku we're talking about. Political geniuses, masters of spin and flipping the story. If the secret got out... who cares?

Seriously, who cares if the Jedi know he’s a Sith, now? The war's already started, Order 66 is right around the corner. He won't even bother pretending he's a good guy, with the Jedi.

Him playing the role of the "villain" when facing the Republic also makes it so that the Senate will want to keep the war going until he's captured or dead.

And because they're at war, he can simply wave the fiendish acts the Republic lays at his feet as "slanderous propaganda" in front of the Separatists, they'll just eat it up.

Furthermore, Dooku being his true, ruthless self when engaging with the Republic also has a second perk: it'll make the Jedi look bad.

'Cause the galaxy doesn't really get what a Sith Lord is, they think it's just some Jedi variant. So that's still a Jedi, right?

As such, Dooku's cruel actions and cruelty then feed into the anti-Jedi conspiracy theories about them "starting the war" and the growing distrust that'll make it so that - when the Jedi are eventually wiped out - the general public will just go "good riddance".

Which was the main goal of the entire Clone War conflict.

TLDR:

The guy we see in most of Attack of the Clones is Count Dooku, political idealist, AKA who he presents himself to be.

The characterization we see at the end of Attack of the Clones, in The Clone Wars and in Revenge of the Sith is that of Darth Tyranus, Sith Lord, AKA his true self.

George Lucas Quotes:

About Dooku’s valid points:

“I wanted a more sophisticated kind of villain. Dooku’s disenchantment with the corruption in the [Republic] is actually valid. It’s all valid. So, Chris plays it as, “Is he really a villain or is he just someone who is disenchanted and trying to make things right?”” - Starlog Magazine #300, 2002

“The confrontation between Obi-Wan and Dooku originally was a confrontation between Padmé and Dooku, and it was a political thing. I decided, after seeing the movie, that I didn’t need that scene with Padmé and Dooku, it was in the wrong part of the picture, and this one, with Obi-Wan, would be more appropriate. It would work better if Dooku would actually tell the truth about what’s going on and then create a situation where nobody believed him. And it also allows you to kinda have some sympathy for Dooku in that he carries the sympathies of most of the Jedi which is that the Senate is corrupt and is incapable of carrying out any meaningful actions because they argue about everything all the time.” - Attack of the Clones, Director’s Commentary, 2002

About the similarities between Anakin and Dooku:

“[In the garage scene, Anakin] sort of lays out his ambition and you’ll see later on his ambition and his dialogue here is the same as Dooku’s. He says “I will become more powerful than every Jedi.” And you’ll hear later on Dooku will say “I have become more powerful than any Jedi.” [...] And Dooku is, kind of, the fallen Jedi who was converted to the Dark Side because the other Sith Lord didn’t have time to start from scratch, and so we can see that that’s where this is going to lead which is that it is possible for a Jedi to be converted. It is possible for a Jedi to want to become more powerful.” - Attack of the Clones, Director’s Commentary, 2002

“I needed to get across the point that Jedi can leave the Order, to set up what happens with Anakin later on. Also, in the end when you realize that Dooku is Darth Tyranus, it explains what Darth Sidious did after Darth Maul was killed: he seduce a Jedi who had become disenchanted with the Republic. He preyed on that disenchantment and converted him to the dark side, which is also a setup for what happens with Anakin.” - Mythmaking: Behind the Scenes of Attack of the Clones, 2002

About Dooku’s true nature:

“If you put two Sith together, they try to get others to join them to get rid of the other Sith. Dooku's ambition here is really to get rid of Darth Sidious. He's trying to get Obi-Wan's assistance in that [...] so that he and Obi-Wan could overthrow Sidious and take over. And it's exactly the same scene as when Darth Vader does it with Luke to try to get rid of Sidious.” - Attack of the Clones, Commentary Track 2, 2002

“In the midst of this turmoil, a separatist movement was formed under the leadership of the charismatic former Jedi Count Dooku. By promising an alternative to the corruption and greed that was rotting the Republic from within, Dooku was able to persuade thousands of star systems to secede from the Republic. Unbeknownst to most of his followers, Dooku was himself a Dark Lord of the Sith, acting in collusion with his master, Darth Sidious, who, over the years, had struck an unholy alliance with the greater forces of commerce and their private droid armies.” - Shatterpoint, Prologue, 2004

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khayltille

1 year ago

The most striking thing about Papyrus (aside from his limitless positivity) is the fact that it is literally impossible to die in a fight against him. Even Toriel, who starts purposefully missing you once your health gets low enough, can accidentally kill you, but Papyrus? It is literally impossible. Papyrus has incredible control over his power! Wow, what a great and impressive skeleton. And, even though he could probably deal some legit damage to you on the murder run, his only action is to spare you, because he’s heckin worried about this little emotionless murder child.

A lot of people like swap aus where Sans is the one that dies and Papyrus is forced to shed his naivete and face you going all-out, which makes sense, but also, Papyrus is just so. Papyrus. I feel like if Papyrus had to be the final murder-run boss, it’d be more like, “After losing Sans, the world seems like a different place. I can’t imagine what you must’ve gone through for you to see the world the way you do.”

He only has one attack, but it’s a really long one and powerful one (kind of like Sans’ before his ‘special attack’), plus he talks during it, which would be pretty distracting. whenever he gets your hp down to 1, combat automatically stops and you’re ejected back into the judgement room. if you try to talk to him without healing, he’ll just say you’re too hurt - a gust of wind could knock you over! after you heal at the conveniently placed save point and go back to fight him, he has stuff to say about how you don’t have to be alone, you don’t have to do this, you might think there isn’t any good in you and it’s too late to change, but there is and it isn’t! After a few of those, he’ll talk about Undyne and Sans, and they always tried to help him, even when they thought he wouldn’t notice. He’s got a ton of stories about that. After he says his piece there’s an option to either fight or don’t fight, and every time you pick fight he looks disappointed, but he goes all out. He’s always able to be spared.

if you survive his attack, he goes down in one hit. his last words would probably be an apology, even though he tried really hard he still couldn’t show you a better path

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khayltille

8 months ago

Jinx : 😠

Silco : you’re my daughter 🥺 , I’ll never forsake you

Jinx : 🥺

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khayltille

5 months ago

I'm recently into sneville, snuna and the trio( I'll call it snuneville if it doesn't have a name yet)... have no idea what on earth I drew so please don't ask anything …🙇‍♀️🙇‍♀️🙇‍♀️🙇‍♀️🙇‍♀️💦💦💦💦

neville and luna look after snape who survived the war while suffered brain injury↓

( just want to see him being disabled and fragile I'm so sorry 😇🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

Kim Kitsuragi shitpost voicelines!

Please see end of post if you want to use these!

Submitted by you, voted for by you, I'd like to present the voicelines you were just dying to hear being said by Kim - dutifully performed by the brilliant Jullian Champenois.

In 10th place,

How did we get here? We walked, believe it or not. You were not entirely lucid.

In 9th place,

I want to have fuck with you.

In 8th place, Normal people, when they go down a slide - they're fine.

Submission idea attributed to this post.

In 7th place, No, detective, I do not just want to go apeshit.

Submitted by bowyooo. In 6th place, Apartment complex? I find it quite simple.

Submitted by elelei. In 5th place, Officer, what the fuck was that?

In 4th place, Trans rights are human rights, detective. Obviously.

In 3rd place, Do I like men? Man is a hopeless creature. I don't like much of anyone. ...Oh, if you meant sexually, then, yes.

In 2nd place,

Detective, Instead of worrying about appearing 'submissive and breedable', please make sure your paperwork is submitted and readable.

Submitted by scrollingdown. And finally, in 1st place, the voice line you all wanted to hear so so badly is...

I'm da king of da highway.

Usage

You are welcome and encouraged to use these for memes, shitposts, and other foolish fan content on social media. When you do, please include credit to Jullian Champenois. You can also include a link to his website, tag him on Instagram/Twitter (@julliannailluj), or mention his Youtube channel according to the content you make. Commercial content of any kind - ads, promoted videos, etc - is explicitly forbidden by these usage terms. Anything of this sort will require specific permission by Jullian. Please don't fuck around we love him. That's it! Thank you everyone for participating, reading, and enjoying this silly little project.

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