Not me not shutting up as usual.
It's pretty evident that Karen and Matt vs Fisk and Vanessa are meant to be seen as units when it comes to parallels and foils.
This gets more in line with Karedevil because thematically and writing wise is what makes more sense. If that bothers you, please don't read it.
Vanessa and Fisk do love each other but they love nothing else. Their love makes them even worse people, it makes them more selfish, more brutal, more unrelenting.
Vanessa kills Adam (that, like Frank is right in the middle of the shot) because she knows Fisk won't do it so she will. For him. For them.
Theorically, we were also meant to see the flip side of that and I believe (again nin shipper, I'm just being objective here) that Karen and Matt are there representation of that.
In just a few minutes Karen got to show Matt that, like Foggy, she sees all of him (and it was left implied that like Foggy she loves all of him) but the main difference here is that she pushes Matt to be better, she forgives him his transgressions and loves him in spite of them.
But Karen is one of the reasons Matt went through one of his biggest character arcs (the one of letting people in). She made him see he wasn't alone, that he he has her, and I think she probably regrets having left.
But I do think Vanessa and Fisk are meant to show the dark side of love while Matt and Karen are the representation of the light, healthy side of that love. Potentially, even though Karen obviously has feelings for Frank.
Both foil each other, contrast each other and parallel each other. I believe this is meant to establish them as THE couples of the story, but for different reasons.
I think is disingenuous to believe that they'd get Matt and Karen together just due to the comics. There's enough textual and visual cues on both the Netflix and Disney parts of this that lead me see that as possibility.
I can’t believe that Matt Murdock, Karen Page, and Frank Castle had an onscreen threesome in the season one finale of Daredevil: Born Again…
forgot that inside that icon there’s still a young girl from new york
and he walks like a bitch too
absolutely obsessed with the dynamic between Matt and Frank it's gotta be one of my favorite character dynamics of all time. Frank kills people as a hobby and Matt has never killed in his life. they can't have a conversation without cursing each other out. they trust each other enough to hold one another as they jump off a building. they physically fight more often than not. Frank has seen Matt's bare ass. they're both in love with the same woman who respects herself too much to hook up with either one of them. Matt is a Catholic who believes every soul can be saved except for his own and Frank doesn't think either of theirs needs to be. can anybody hear me is this thing on
anyway i love matt murdock, he’s a lying hypocrite with zero healthy coping skills and even less capacity for honest emotional relationships but goddamn it i love him
TODAY IS THE DAY!!!
HOW ARE WE FEELIN, MATT NATION?
andrew minyard character of all time. he's toxic. he doesn't talk to cops. he has an identical twin brother and they hate each other. he made his identical twin brother promise not to have any other friends and then doesn't even talk to him. he might be a misogynist. his only friends are a born-again lesbian who can beat him up, the runaway son of a yakuza-affiliated serial killer, and his therapist. he's a student athlete. he hates sports. he killed his mother. he's a Mean Girl who runs his friend group like a cult. he's a crim major for the bit. he has an eidetic memory. he's petty. he likes to get people gifts. he does coke sometimes but says it doesn't have any effect on him because he has too many mental illnesses. he's the love interest. he doesn't smile. he was right about wwiii. y2k goth. repeatedly risks his life to help people in situations that have absolutely nothing to do with him and says it's out of boredom. when they picked him up from the psych ward he got in the driver's seat and blasted screamo the whole ride back and didn't say a single word to anyone. oh my god he is exactly five feet tall. he's even gay
Guys 🥹 Karen convinced him not to throw his life away. She reminded him of something beautiful he'd said once, and she said 'Trust me. We'll find another way.' And Matt said 'Okay.'
in retrospect it’s very funny that marvel studios allowed matt to be happy and wear flannel and have lunch with jen’s family in she-hulk before putting him through unimaginable horrors in born again 😭
Daredevil: Born Again Excessive Force | 1.06
they should kiss