L'P VWLOO RQ BRXU PLQG

i got this ask on my strawpage and was gonna type it up in my notes app and post it to twitter, but i really couldn't figure out a way to say it concisely, so i'm answering it here bc it's prob gonna be long lol.

do i think stancest is actually canon? simply put, no. despite how often i'm like "STANCEST IS CANON!!" i truly don't think that AH and the writers intended stan & ford's relationship to be seen through an incestuous lens.

their relationship is def the heart of the show, second only to dipper & mabel's own bond. they are the center of each other's worlds, their story & character arcs revolve almost entirely around each other, and their happy ending is literally the two of them sailing off into the sunset to spend "the rest of their days" together (ford says this almost word-for-word in journal 3).

but i still don't think all of that was meant to be taken romantically.

in my opinion, where things start to get a little weird is, surprisingly enough, ford's relationship with bill.

the rest is under a cut bc HOLY SHIT this got longer than i expected.

there's no denying that bill was written to deliberately parallel stan in a number of ways, from his mannerisms, to his conman status, to the fact that he calls ford the same name stan did when they were kids.

he's written in a very intentional way that makes him serve as both stan's parallel and his foil, especially in their respective relationships to ford (bill feeds into ford's ego and encourages him to aspire for greatness alone, stan has always been a direct obstacle & challenge to ford's ego, accidentally ruining his chances at WCT & encouraging him to live out their childhood dream together; bill valued infinite power over his own family and destroyed his dimension as a result, stan valued his family over everything, and saved ford and his dimension as a result).

normally, this wouldn't be that big of a deal to a stancest shipper like myself. but as the book of bill & the accompanying website all but confirmed in big, flashing neon lights, ford & bill have a romantic history and are exes.

having the two people closest to ford be compared to one another is one thing. having ford be drawn to bill because of how similar he is to the brother he secretly misses is one thing.

having ford be romantically involved with said character is what makes me raise an eyebrow lol.

again, do i think ford is literally a brocon who's got repressed sexual/romantic feelings for stan?

no.

i do, however, think he has unresolved Brother Issues that led him to subconsciously find comfort in a romantic partner that reminded him of stan (right down to bill calling him stan's nickname for him) in much the same way a person with "daddy issues" may seek out affection & intimacy from someone who reminds them of their father (or is just "fatherly" in general).

that much, i believe, was actually intentional. it's just too blatant to not be lol. it'd be a completely different story if either

bill & stan were nothing alike (untrue) or

ford & bill's relationship was strictly platonic and didn't have any romantic implications (also untrue)

i've said this before, but this isn't just a case of "oh, ford fell in love with someone who just coincidentally reminds him of his brother." bill's use of the nickname "sixer" during their first encounter was a deliberate attempt at appealing to a part of ford that was repressed, vulnerable, and aching, in order to get ford's guard down and make it easier for ford to trust him, and it worked.

billford is a ship that, to put it bluntly, would not exist without ford's buried feelings for stan, even disregarding shipping/incest/etc. ford's desire to be close to stan even platonically is what allowed bill to needle his way into ford's heart in the first place.

and all of this wouldn't be that weird if, again, bill hadn't continued to feed into ford's longing for stan even after they'd established a romantic relationship, by still calling him "sixer" and trying to permanently sever the relationship he had with stan specifically, once he and ford broke up (the phone call he tried to make while in ford's body that was described in tbob).

to put it another way, imagine if wendy was basically an older, taller mabel, or if any of mabel's crushes were eerily similar to dipper. people in the fandom would def take notice and view it as a little strange. so i don't get how people can look at ford dating someone so blatantly and intentionally similar to stan and think to themselves "ah yes, this is normal. ford is completely Normal and definitely doesn't have any underlying issues whatsoever" lmao

to conclude: no, i don't think ford & stan's relationship is actually canonically romantic, nor do i think ford falling in love with bill was incestuous, necessarily.

but i do think that he had a desperate longing to reconcile with stan buried DEEEEEEP down, and it manifested itself in the form of being attracted to bill, which is probably why he never bothered correcting bill's use of the nickname "sixer" since their very first meeting, or ever expressed that it made him uncomfortable.

SORRY FOE THE DUMP IM CATCHING UP ITS BEEN A HOT MINUTE

Original source: my mates playing with their dollies

The tight writing in Gravity Falls just gets crazier and crazier because Alex Hirsch in the director’s commentary of Dipper & Mabel vs. the Future (11:25) says:

“Ford sees Dipper as someone who’s special like himself. That’s Ford’s great flaw, is arrogance. Is he believes that there’s special people, and everyone else. That human attachments are actually weaknesses. And the song and dance that he’s giving Dipper right now, is the song and dance that he gave McGucket, back when they were younger… ‘You and me are different, we’re better than everyone else. We have a path that no one else can understand, and only us can do this.’ It’s a very seductive idea for Dipper… Dipper is a smart kid, but Ford’s projecting. Ford loves Dipper because he sees someone who’ll tell him ‘yes’ to everything. Who’ll never challenge him, who’ll do a really insane dangerous mission.”

I CAN’T BE THE ONLY ONE WHO’S SEEING THE BILL -> FORD -> DIPPER PIPELINE HERE. YOU CAN JUST REPLACE THE NAMES IN THE ABOVE QUOTE. I’M GOING INSANE.

Gravity Falls and the cycle of “Hey, person who feels outcast from your society like me, you’re special, fuck human connection, join me and be something great!”

These two make me sick

One morning, in the Oregon shack, Stanford, Stanley, and Fiddleford were having breakfast together. Fiddleford brought up a paper he’d recently read, The Evolution of Social Attitudes Towards Homosexual Relationships in 20th-Century America: A Historical Analysis, and shared some of the views it mentioned. For example, gay men might tend to pursue fashionable and personalized styles of clothing and have a higher appreciation for pop music, dance music, and the arts. Additionally, they might show a distinctive social behavior pattern with more frequent and intimate interactions within their social circles.

Stanley: Ha, I always thought men who liked theater were kind of sissy.

Stanford: I think the article oversimplifies things. Just because someone likes art doesn’t mean they’re necessarily gay.

Fiddleford: That’s true, just like being gay doesn’t necessarily mean you enjoy theater. I don’t believe that a gay man’s social behavior can be summarized; there are always exceptions. And those who haven’t acknowledged their orientation haven’t been observed either. They probably just seem like regular people, like you and me.

Fiddleford: Haha, but a guy like Stanley probably wouldn’t be mistaken, right?

Stanley: Oh, no, I’ve been with a guy before. But you can’t tell, right?

Fiddleford: Hold on.

Fiddleford: Raccoons doing the jitterbug! You’ve been with a guy??

Stanley: Yeah, it was a long time ago. We were in high school, and we broke up ages ago.

Fiddleford: Wow… that’s… unexpected, in every way. I thought you were into women; I even saw you flirting with Susan at the diner. Don’t you like women?

Stanley: I’ve only been with that one guy. But I guess gender doesn’t mean much to me—I’m open either way. Sex is just sex; as long as there’s chemistry, it’s fine.

Fiddleford: So, back in high school, it was just about sex? Then I’m not sure that would classify as a gay relationship since straight men do that kind of thing too—sorry if that’s too blunt.

Stanley: No problem, I don’t mind. We’re just chatting. We did go on dates a lot, so I guess we were pretty serious back then.

Fiddleford: So it was a relationship? You must have faced a lot of pressure back then.

Stanley: Yeah, some.

Fiddleford: Who confessed first?

Stanley thinking: I don’t think… anyone confessed. We just ended up together.

Fiddleford: You didn’t talk about it? How does that even happen?

Stanford: It happened naturally, just going with feelings.

Stanley: Lust, that’s what it was.

Fiddleford: Wait, uh, Ford, you knew about this?

Stanford: I did.

Fiddleford: Well, that makes sense; you’re twins, after all. I guess secrets are hard to keep. So, when did you two break up?

Stanley: Right around graduation. He was a good student and wanted to go to college in another city. I didn’t care for school and wanted to work right away. We couldn’t agree, so we just split up.

Fiddleford: You didn’t try long-distance?

Stanley: You know that never works. Thinking that letters and calls can keep a relationship going—that’s a lie told by cowards who don’t have the courage to break up. Right, Ford?

Stanford: True enough.

Fiddleford: Makes sense. Sounds like you’ve thought about this for a long time. So, were you the one who broke it off?

Stanley: No, it wasn’t me.

Fiddleford: Oh… I’m sorry. That must have been hard on you. My first breakup had me crying with my banjo in my room for three days. How long did you cry?

Stanley: I didn’t cry.

Fiddleford: Really?

Stanley: It’s been a long time. Everyone goes through breakups; I don’t care anymore.

Fiddleford: But it was your first love, and you broke up over something like that. It’s a shame. Have you kept in touch since?

Stanley: Yeah, we have.

Fiddleford: And now that you’re both working, you haven’t tried to—

Stanley: —Oh, no. No way. Getting back with an ex is just plain stupid.

Fiddleford: But you were happy together, weren’t you? Honestly, distance isn’t an insurmountable problem, and you didn’t break up because of a loss of love. If it were me, I’d at least try to see if it could work.

Stanley: You’ve got the wrong idea. We broke up pretty badly. But yeah, I still have some good memories.

Fiddleford: Oh?

Stanley: We used to go to the beach a lot. We didn’t do much, just talked. Well, and other things. The beach was right by our town. It was beautiful when there weren’t people around, so we’d skip class and go there in the afternoons. A few years back, when I passed through our hometown, I went to see it. Now it’s a tourist spot, packed with people.

Fiddleford: Skipping class? Didn’t you say he was a good student? Why would he skip class?

Stanley: Yeah, why indeed?

Fiddleford: Right? I mean, with all the homework, studying, and essays, I was constantly busy back then. How did he manage it?

Stanley: Huh, I never thought about that.

Stanley: Ford, how did you manage it back then?

Stanforddrizzling maple syrup on pancakes: Stayed up late doing homework.

Stanley: Ah, so that’s it—stayed up late doing homework.

Fiddleford: Oh.

Fiddleford: Wait, hold on.

haha i dont have the heart to finish these

the original and the “poodle skirt” variation. I might go back to these at some point. Make em’ into stickers~

colored doodles from this set

My magnum opus and introduction to the Flatland fandom

Mas joto que un club de gaes no mames

Bonus thing. I have a college to do but also the funnies is more important clearly

I saw that ask you got and i just wanted to say that it's so funny to me when people are like "why would you ship stancest ew" acting like they didn't sail off into the sunset together after DECADES of Stan openly pining for Ford. If they weren't written as siblings they would hands down be the most popular ship of the show

There's a long answer, and then there's the tldr at the bottom marked in red text. Long answer: If they weren't siblings, you literally wouldn't be able to escape this ship. It would have been THE ship of tumblr after the finale had aired, considered the "healthy" ship and the good ending, would be considered canon even if they didn't kiss, and it would be the standard by which all the other ships are judged. You would have people writing essays about how they literally took off on a ship, guys! It's so obvious and a metaphor for marriage and and- But here's where I can extend a bit of empathy that perhaps they wouldn't give me, as well as look at things from the perspective as someone who has seen shipping culture their entire lives. First off- most people don't want to fuck their siblings. I know, shocker. Most people who ship Stancest probably do not want to fuck their siblings, but people who don't CERTAINLY do not want to. It's the most repulsive thought in the world to them. There is such thing as being in such a close platonic relationship that it's an impossible thought. I think a lot of people who want Stancest shippers to die or whatever find that kind of desire utterly repulsive, that and let's be real, 1nc3st in real life is rife with abuse. It isn't a healthy thought to get those wires crossed. People who do not like this ship are empathizing with either of the brothers and projecting their own repulsion onto them. But here's the other bit. I'm not shipping Stan and Ford because they're siblings. Most of my ships are not 1nc3stuous. I don't find that element hot or cute, and while I'm not here to harsh anyone's vibe, if that's the only reason you ship Stancest I really don't want to talk with you about these characters. People see ships as inherently sexual, as inherently sexualizing, as "you must only ship this because you want to see the characters fuck". And mind you, with Stancest I don't see it as a bad thing at all to draw them doing things or being attractive together, etc etc. Not at all, and I'd be a hypocrite for saying otherwise. My point is, that's where people's minds go, that's the assumption that they make. They find 1nc3st repulsive, and clearly the ONLY reason I would ship it is because I like sexualizing that and only that aspect about it. Basically, they assume I must LOVE 1nc3st in and of itself, because otherwise why would I ship brothers? Now here's where I go back to the first statement, because most people I've seen don't just ship them for that reason.

You ever seen that meme about "if they have chemistry, I can't make them NOT have chemistry"? That's why I'm here. EVERYTHING about how Stan and Ford are written is tailor made to be SHIPPED. Aside from literally bounding away on a ship, they have a closeness and codependency that most brothers in fiction do not. Alex himself has said they need each other, Ford in the third journal said he was going to spend the rest of his days making up to Stanley. Stanley has spent his entire life wanting NOTHING but his family, his brother by his side. He seems more bonded to his brother than to any one he's ever tried to date, and Ford likewise. I'm sorry, but these two are not getting a "healthy" ending. They aren't going to be with anyone else. There's no version of them in which they find separate partners after having a little adventure around the world for a year or two then just go off in separate ways. This is the most "childhood friends to lovers" story I've ever seen. These two are NOT healthy to begin with, why would anyone expect them to start when they're that old and that hurt by everything in their pasts? I don't believe it inherently has to be sexually 1nc3stuous, but it could be. Wires are already being crossed. It's rare for anyone to be loyal for 30 years to one person when they aren't in love, and Stan wanted to get his brother back so badly that he forgot his own goals and even threw away his own identity to get him back. His entire life was for Ford, and after Journal 3, it should be obvious that Ford's entire life is for Stan now, too. What I'm trying to say is, while this ship isn't the healthy ending, it is the BEST ending for either of them. I think people who wanted Stan to be able to deny going with Ford don't understand him or his character, or what his character NEEDS, same as Ford. And I think people who try to separate the bros for shipping purposes or who don't want to do 1nc3st or accidental emotional 1nc3st are not fully reading the same things, watching the same things that we are. If they weren't brothers, everyone else would see exactly what we're seeing. They would see this as the love story it is. TLDR: I understand why people won't ship this ship, and I try to be empathetic, but these two have been given the kind of story that would ping the lovers radar to anyone if they weren't brothers and I'm not going to ignore that just because they are.

i'm giving my twt a break from discourse so i'm putting it here: people who are like "UMMMM what does stan have to do w billford????" are either acting deliberately dense bc they hate stancest or they have zero media literacy lol.

ford fucked a dude that canonically parallels his twin brother. THAT'S what stan has to do w billford. and again, i say "canonically" bc it's obvious that their parallels were DELIBERATE. this isn't a case of just like, looking too deeply into things or w/e. the "same coin" theory exists for a reason, and although i don't personally believe in it, it's one of the most popular theories in the entire fandom specifically BECAUSE of stan & bill's blatant similarities.

i already wrote a whole damn novel about it, so i won't repeat myself too much, but i'll just say that believing with your whole chest that stan had NOTHING to do with ford & bill's partnership is actually insane lol.

ford subconsciously missing his brother and projecting his desire to reconcile with him onto bill, as well as bill PURPOSELY stealing stan's childhood nickname for him ("sixer") and copying many of his mannerisms in order to more easily manipulate ford are literally the foundation on which their relationship was built. stan's influence is present in their VERY FIRST MEETING when bill calls ford "sixer." c'mon now. even if you don't ship stancest, the link between stan & billford is undeniable.

Stancestttttttt! I have the need.. THE NEED FOR FORDYLEEEEE

kiss ‘im hard ‘til he sees stars!!