Katyyyyyy ...

INTERVIEWS WITH OLEANDER GARDEN, CRISPPYBOAT AND ADAM PYPE

For my current video on fictional dead MMO/servers in games (https://youtu.be/AXSJ27bTRzw), I interviewed some developers with experience creating such settings. Oleander Garden (Autogeny), Crisppyboat (NetEscape) and Adam Pype (No Players Online) kindly took the time to discuss the creation of their respective games, with their answers compiled here:

What gave you the inspiration to use an empty MMO setting?

Oleander Garden (Autogeny):

The post-vaporwave / hauntology / Dan Bell deadmall universe was at its apex when I started working on Autogeny in 2018; mostly I wanted to play with that sense of longing for lost futures, & put it in conversation with the ideas the Pagan games had been orbiting around (i.e. contemporary technological mythology, poetic-making, degraded game forms). The dead y2k MMO format was a fun solution that had a little tie in to everything I wanted the game to think about.

Crisppyboat (NetEscape):

The idea came to me when watching Redlyne's video series on dead mmos, and theories about cults within them. Just the atmosphere that brings with it, a seemingly derelict digital landscape, rich in history from past users, now occupied by some malevolent force (or one that’s always been around) really fascinated me! Especially with the popularity of liminal spaces, I really connected with the idea of exploring the online equivalent of that. For this game jam version it was on a fairly small scale (only about 4 areas) but we’d love to explore that idea with a more believable expansive online space, that was really the heart of the idea for me. Sitting alone at night and logging into an abandoned online game, shifting through the past memories of long forgotten players in a vast digital space. It has this sort of unnerving feeling to it, why's this still up after all this time and who knows what could still be around. 

Adam Pype (No Players Online):

I was actually doing an exchange at the time when I was making the original version of the game (from 2019) at a game design school in the netherlands. i reallyy hated this class because it was super designed focus without much practical work, and im really more of a design-by-doing person. anyways, one of the assignments was making a map for Unreal Tournament, and it was this tedious process of having to block out the level and then write endless documentation about the design process. i guess the class was super triple-A focused or something. since halloween was coming up and i was still doing game-a-month at the time, i really wanted to give a go at making something super scary. and as i was doing this assignment i really enjoyed just walking around the little map without any bots, and just taking in the vibes. i did a little extra flair to my map by adding ambient sounds to it (i have a video of that actually, here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_22Q_oNwk0) and it really did a lot for the atmosphere. then i remember that as a kid i used to play GMOD a lot with my friend, and because I was always hosting the server and our computers were very slow, it would always take like 10 minutes at least for my friend to join. adding that ambient sound really reminded me of that, because gmod maps always have this ambient sound in them that's a bit unsettling. i remember being so scared to wander around on my own because these maps were always known to have jump scares, so i would just wait at spawn for my friend. so i realised that this would make for a cool horror game. i originally planned to just port the map into unity, but then i decided against it because it wouldve been more work than it was worth. so i really quickly made a map that didnt make a lot of sense and made it somewhat symmetrical. ironically, not thinking about it too much made it so good, because the map is a bit disorienting, which is perfect for a horror game. it's a little bit funny that i found the most success by making a multiplayer map that was badly designed instead of what this class was trying to teach me. :-)

Did you initially have specific themes you wanted to explore or did the idea of having an empty mmo setting come first?

Oleander Garden (Autogeny):

Ideas came first, setting later! A month before the game came out I still wasn't 100% sure I was going to commit to that framing device actually - otherwise it would have been a straightforward haunted-EXE type of deal, like luna game (2011) or those 2010s haunted video game creepypastas. I'm glad I went with it; 'digital space you inhabited' is a much cooler ('weightier?') frame for this sort of story.

Crisppyboat (NetEscape):

I think the setting had developed first before any specific themes came to mind, but to me NetEscape in a lot of ways represents the melancholy that comes from the loss of fun, safe virtual spaces. Like many people I grew up in these spaces and to see them shuttered in favour of a handful of social media platforms really fills me with a sort of nostalgic sadness, as genuinely I felt that these spaces were really important for kids and young adults. The term "dead internet" comes up a lot nowadays and I feel in part it can be attributed to the sort of forced migration towards a handful of social media platforms devoid of the liberties and expression niche online spaces provided for people. Other than that, existentialism as a theme kind of just fell into place when attempting to craft a story for the concept.

What was it about the empty server/MMO concept that helped you explore the game's themes?

Oleander Garden (Autogeny):

I think the multiplayer and especially persistent-multiplayer character of an MMO makes that kind of game world feel a lot more like /a space/ and less like a strictly authored object; that helped make things feel 'lived in', 'decayed', 'lost', &c. in a way that really worked with the whole 'self-making out of techno-mythic-rubble' thing the game was going for.  Likewise, I suspect the 1995-2004ish era of MMO design in particular - which was much less authored, much more sandboxy, much more scattershot and weird - is (A) /especially/ good at producing that impression, and (B) developed out of a very specific mythical-ideological project which has now been abandoned: the prevailing y2k notion that one might live a 'second life' in a 'digital world', which seems almost quaint or pastoral today. I figured this would produce a certain feeling of dislocation, of 'living in the ruins'.

Crisppyboat (NetEscape):

We use the internet as an escape from reality, and now with the progression of time a lot of these places no longer exist or stand dormant. The empty mmo, to me, represents a sort of time capsule for people you’ve never met. A public space where people put so much of themselves into it, you get to learn so much just through the fragments they’ve left behind. It’s this sort of melancholy nostalgia that I hope we can really channel in the game’s full release.

Adam Pype (No Players Online):

the first version of the game had no story at all. i just did the whole setup of being alone in a multiplayer game, and then a ghost showing up and it ended with a jumpscare. i showed this off at an event on the last day of the month and was planning to publish the game the day after. people really liked the setup but they were dissapointed it just ended on a jumpscare and had no point to it. so on the walk home i thought about adding a story to it. at the time i was really kind of against (or uninterested even) in adding a narrative to my games. looking back on it it's a bit stupid, but i figured it would be a good opportunity to try out adding a story to one of my games. so that same night i quickly added in a story by having the developer join just before the end and explaining that the ghost was his dead wife and that capturing the last flag would undo all of his work. it was a bit rushed, and most of the critique i got was that it was a bit cliché. but without it the game would have been super uninteresting and nobody would have liked it as much. really goes to show that people really like a story :) lesson learned! now many years later we're doing this big version of the game because the original was such a success (mostly thanks to the ARG i think). since i'm now much more of a matured developer I wanted to really focus in on the story and work it into something that is actually interesting, has depth, cool characters, and not just a story about a dead wife stuck in a game (which is a bit of an overplayed trope maybe). but, i had to work with what I had, since it is a successor. i think the direction we're going in now is much much more interesting, making it about old tech more broadly as a vehicle for horror and also telling the story about the relationship between john and sarah, and giving sarah more agency. for the full game we are kind of purposefully doing the opposite of what the original did. by not letting john say anything until the very end, and making sarah more of the main character. in the end I think the game is also much more about grief and using the concept of a dead person stuck in a game and the obsession of the developer to revive her as a kind of allegory about creative work and obsession over your work preventing you from finishing it. this is something i personally quite strongly believe in, that it's important not to let a project take control of your life, and making it so important that it never gets done. the unfinished fps game prototype is so much about this, here is this game that had so much potential and interest, but the developers were so busy trying to make it into this impossible thing that people just lost interest and it never becomes something real or alive. the dead server is literally a testament to a dead idea, a dead person, an unfulfilled potential and a constant reminder of not being able to let go.

What is it about this setting that lends itself well to the horror genre? What kinds of things in the empty server/MMO space did you specifically think about including and/or subverting to make the experience scarier? 

Oleander Garden (Autogeny):

 Living in the shadowed ruins of a gestalt social project which has fallen away and left monoliths behind - this is the essential characteristic of the 19th century European gothic novel, and the 20th century southern gothic that followed. Maybe we could say that 'living in the ruins of an MMO' works as a sort of '21st century gothic', i.e., that the dead server spooks us for the same reason dead castles spooked Bram Stoker, and dead plantations spooked Faulkner. It's not the space, precisely: it's the social field that created that sort of space, and the way its influence still lingers. Playing too much Everquest will probably destroy your life, but there's something fantastical and romantic about early Everquest stories - people waking up at 3AM to go kill a dragon with 70-odd strangers in their shared digital space. There's nothing romantic about Meta or AI-girlfriends: only the life obliterating part survived. In the home stretch of development I tried to give Autogeny lots of little details that would scream 'early MMO' in particular. Open world dungeons with bosses to farm, impossible zone transitions: this sort of thing. I don't know if it would have worked if it felt like Final Fantasy XIV, you know? It had to be an old MMO.

Crisppyboat (NetEscape):

We tried to play with sound and limitation to generate horror. Sound played a huge role, (masterfully provided by louceph) stuff like repeating footsteps and ambient noise really added a lot to the overall experience of wandering alone. Taking inspiration from Iron lung, I really pushed for the on screen navigation system to give a bit more anxiety in the moment, having it be limited, and a bit harder to quickly turn or walk if you catch something in the corner of your eye. We sort of quickly realized that there were a lot of pitfalls in presenting the game in a totally accurate, realistic way without confusing the player, we actually had to patch in a notification sound for the file system just cause a lot of people would never bother actually checking the photos they took during the game. In the games full version we’re going to try and add stuff like working text chat/emotes, and other core staples to really give it that believable feeling, the jam version turned out nice but I’m really excited to go extra hard on hammering down what makes a game feel like a real abandoned mmo. 

Adam Pype (No Players Online):

I think old tech, limitations of old tech and just old design standards or quirks or imperfections are all things that make something feel a bit uncanny and scary. games nowadays are so juicy and smooth and responsive you are constantly at ease because you're being taken care of, there is no friction. all those small things, those small barriers make the game feel like an ominous force, or like a big heavy lid on a tomb that you have to tear off. there's something powerful with horror when you have to make a player do something tedious with the anticipation of the scare. going through that old server list menu really feels like you're undusting something. you also can't jump, you cant look very far ahead. it makes it all feel so evil... then there is also the subversion of it, adding things for authenticity that have no point. you have a gun but there is nothing to shoot, you have a player list but nobody is online, you have a match timer but the match never ends, even delivering the flags doesnt have a point because there is no game because nobody is on the other team. it makes the whole environment feel like you're not welcome, like it's just this graveyard and all you're doing is trampling the flowers. another thing is that everything in the game is "in-story". the game's story is about someone being on this mysterious computer and discovering old and scary things. it's cool because everything from pressing buttons or opening applications, none of it is OOC, it's all supposed to be the experience of discovering this thing that wasn't meant for you, this invasion of privacy and literally uncovering some old skeletons. this is kind of the core design principle for the game, if one of the games in the forum is a bit badly made that's like part of the story cause it's a hobby gamedev. everything is supposed to be authentic and part of the narrative. the full game will have no open ends, every single file and link or application has a point or some subtext.

Has there been any interesting feedback from players that made you think about the empty server/MMO setting in a new way?

Oleander Garden (Autogeny):

Yeah! It especially makes me smile when I find some cool new dead-mmo game, and it turns out the developer liked Autogeny, and figured they could do the idea better, or in a different way. I wasn't sure if the conceit was too particular, but it seems like it really resonated with people - it's like I got to contribute a little formalism to the tapestry of weirdo indie-game culture, you know?  It's cute and it's probably the main thing that keeps me feeling positive about the game. Now I get to play different games, by different people, with their own ideas about the gothic digital-plaza.

Crisppyboat (NetEscape):

Well, one thing that I sort of regret for the demo version was implementing the text chat and emotes as fun visual dressing rather then actually functional, a lot of people kept interacting with it like they’d be able to have full conversions in the game, it’s something we’d like to do for the full release but it wasn’t possible on this jam version. A lot of feedback was also related to the overall story and how it was presented. We plan on focusing way more on the actual exploration of the abandoned space, as that seems to be what people were mostly interested in (as am I haha). Of course the actual way in which the story was presented (taking photos to get files) was not realistic to a mmo at all but I think there's a lot of potential towards the connectivity between actions in the game and the desktop itself. Hypnospace comes to mind as a huge inspiration, doing something similar to that but in 3D would be great. It makes me really excited to explore mmo staples like photography, mini games and other realistic features, turning them into puzzles throughout the full game. We also found a lot of people were annoyed by the slow movement, but I felt that element would be super important for the kind of slow burn anxiety that we went for with this jam version, plus you’d move pretty slow in those old games haha.

There's a pretty big amount of interest in dead MMOs/game servers these days! What is it about them that you personally think is intriguing? Is it mainly just nostalgic elements or are there less prominent aspects that you think make them so interesting?

Oleander Garden (Autogeny):

I don't think it can just be nostalgia, in the empty sense of 'consumer fantasy'. If that was the case, you would expect consumer activity to follow a similar pattern to e.g. console game nostalgia (buying lots of knick knacks and status signifiers, attaching cultural value to a particular major corporation, &c.) Instead, we got this cool thriving scene of DIY horror, and illegal pirate revival servers! Critically, the dead mmo genre is not /just/ pro-forma nostalgic-horror (e.g. afraid of a terrible, romantic past) but also, as Mark Fisher might have said, essentially 'Hauntological' - it's oriented towards a speculative /lost future/. There's a certain longing for a separate digital world, and a new realm of human activity Online - which seemed totally possible, until the real world got digitized, and the digital world died an unceremonious death. From this the dead-mmo form can draw all the drama and emotional weight of a failed revolution, in our deeply repressed cultural milieu, where emerging revolutions fail before they get started.

Crisppyboat (NetEscape):

Honestly I think it’s just the generation that had been raised on mmos like this having grown up with nostalgia for these spaces. Online chat games have basically come and gone, contained in a specific generation of kids, and I think it’s pretty profound how impactful it still is on us. For me just the idea of an online games player legacy really fascinates me. In a way it's almost like exploring an abandoned home or school, where you get the opportunity to catch glimpses of lives and relationships etched into the environment. Like any abandoned or “liminal space” I think people find it intriguing based on the mystery of discovery, finding something clearly human made, and stopping to think how or why they did it. It's an extremely fresh and untapped market, because it is so relatively new, there’s a lot of potential. We see it a lot in internet horror, stuff that at this point has been around for decades, where we can start collectively referring to it in media.

Adam Pype (No Players Online):

everyone keeps telling me this but i haven't really looked into it! it doesnt surprise me though, i think this fear of being alone in a multiplayer game is a pretty shared experience and everyone who's had it is now old enough to make games about it. i wasn't really inspired by any game in particular, i would say the main inspiration i had was Petscop, which is also about an abandoned unfinished game that has a whole layer under it revealing some ulterior use for the game. this whole idea of a game being a facade hiding some grand conspiracy under it is soo interesting to me. it's like easter eggs or 4th wall breaking stuff, or little out of bounds areas. it makes you think about what's hidden underneath all of this stuff you were meant to see. i've always as a kid thought so much about "what if there is a whole other level behind this wall" or like these creepypastas like Ben Drowned or even the luigi stuff in Super Mario 64. the idea that this thing you know and love has something sinister and it was always there you just never noticed will always play well into people's fears.

A huge thank you to Oleander Garden, Crisppyboat and Adam Pype for taking the time to be interviewed.

Oleander Garden: https://x.com/void_hyacinth

Autogeny: https://store.steampowered.com/app/1165750/PAGAN_Autogeny/

Crisppyboat: https://x.com/CrisppyBoat

NetEscape: https://store.steampowered.com/app/3344890/NetEscape/

Adam Pype: https://x.com/adampi

No Players Online: https://store.steampowered.com/app/2701800/No_Players_Online/

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they're finally here....... the HalOPE artbook and OST releases!

after much delay, the HalOPE artbook and OST are now available for purchase!

The artbook contains 160 pages of concept art, scrapped content, and developer commentary. also a lot of silly doodles. so many silly doodles

The OST contains the 30 tracks found in-game, along with 17 bonus tracks. Many of the tracks were also edited from their in-game counterparts in order to flow better as an album release.

If you like the game and want to support me, I would greatly appreciate if you checked out either of these. Like everything else I make, I poured my heart into them.

if you haven't played HalOPE and have no idea what I'm talking about... the game itself is free! go play it!

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INTERVIEW WITH SAM BARLOW AND TOMM HULETT ON SILENT HILL SHATTERED MEMORIES

As part of my Shattered Memories video, I decided to try and reach out to Designer Sam Barlow and Producer Tomm Hulett to ask them some questions. And I was delighted that they said yes! I couldn't fit everything into my video, but what they shared was too interesting not to post somewhere in its entirety! HERE IT GOES:

What was it like building the profiling system and what kind of resources did you tap into? I read that professionals helped and even analysed some of the team members! What psychological test was most surprising and interesting to you?

SAM: It was a deep dive into psychometrics! Yeah we spoke with academics who had done work into eye tracking. We put the team through a battery of personality tests to have some data to work off of. I worked with a therapist who insisted I attend sessions as a patient and genuinely, in order to make things credible. The most fun (surprising!?) anecdote is that we were working off the 5 factor personality model, which is the popular one. The fifth factor of the 5 is psychopathy. But we ended up dropping that factor because we found that everyone naturally behaves a bit like a psychopath when playing a game! So it kinda skewed the data.

TOMM: My related answer - As soon as I read the pitch with the psych profiling and how it would change the game world, I instantly (if slightly presumptuously) demanded to Produce the game. This was the type of outside-the-box thinking that I felt suited Silent Hill as a brand, but could also drive it forward with new innovations that would surprise players. Management granted my request, and I made it my personal mission to protect this feature from outside meddling, and to evangelize it across Konami.

In regards to elements of the game (character appearances, dialogue etc.) being tailored to the player’s profile, were there any other features you would have liked to implement that would also change depending on the profile? Also any other things you would have liked to have affected the profile? I saw mentions of Mii data and the Weather Channel for example!

SAM: I think always it was a question of how deep we could go -- the more specific we got, the more money it would have cost! So there were compromises in terms of the number of variations. We'd go in asking for as much as we could think of and then end up compromising and picking the key ones. Could always have used more hairstyles, outfits, or set dressing! It was particularly tight on things like monster animations -- those had to be generic, but fit against any additional animation bones, say an udder -- rather than be unique to each form. The way they moved could have been a real nice differentiator.

Yeah, we really wanted to do some stuff where we pulled in the player's Mii data, or tapped into the local weather/time for their console. But all of those things ended up being things that would have possibly upset the Nintendo guidelines, so we kinda skipped over those. We wanted to find as many ways we could make the player feel seen, and add to the feeling that the Harry they were making was tied to them.

I read that when speaking to some of the developers of the original game, you sought to understand some of their goals with the first title in order to aim for those same targets in SM. What were those goals? Was there anything the developers would have liked to do for the first game (but couldn’t for whatever reason) which were then included in SM?

SAM: Hmmm, I'm not sure we spoke directly to anyone for SH:SM. I know we had access to some people at Konami on Origins, but it was slightly difficult -- a lot of the files/documentation didn't exist anymore, so it wasn't always straightforward to tap into intentions -- as well, SH:1 was kinda of a miracle and product of a very particular moment in time so I think a lot of how the original turned out was organic. We certainly wanted to make something that would feel -- in a fresh way -- like the original felt; rather than rehashing it in a way that would feel like diminishing returns. We wanted to take some of the themes of the first game, and also some of the ideas thrown out by 2 and 3, and take them to a place that was a little bit more lived in. Like there was a vibe I got when going into the K. Gordon house in SH1 that felt so real and domestic and it had a real presence... walking into a domestic living area, that atmosphere of it being abandoned, the proximity of the horror to the domesticity, the uncanny feel. We wanted to tap into that. And to remind people that it was snowing in Silent Hill 1!

Sam, was there anything you took from SM that applied to or evolved in your future games? I think I first noticed your mark the second the VHS intro started playing with a menu in the style of a typical TV interface, the use of technology as an immersive viewpoint in your other titles has been something I’ve always loved!

SAM: Yeah, clearly I have a real interface-within-an-interface thing going on! You could argue that the principal's office puzzle is basically Her Story 0.1! I definitely enjoyed the use of the frame narrative and the idea we had that 'the player is not the protagonist' -- the idea that you create tension between the main character and the player, and explore that for dramatic effect. We deliberately kept shifting POV (3rd to 1st person) and introduced time jumps to create a disconnect with Harry. Also a lot of the way the profile system worked -- vector math and fuzzy logic underpinning choices, rather than binary trees -- has been something I've used in every game since. Under the surface the way that Her Story or Immortality knows about its scenes and connects things, and plays music, etc. is all using a similar setup.

Not a question, but I adored how going into the options/quit game menu would also display that TV interface style, like Cheryl’s view was that outer layer in the narrative that gets peeled back at the end. Reminds me of the use of the screen reflection in Telling Lies in a way!

SAM: Yeah, again, I think this is clearly my thing! Creating layers *between* the player and the narrative in a way that can actually help with a kind of immersion.

I read in a few interviews that it was an important point that every player could finish the game, with some adjustments kicking in if players were struggling. Where do you think your philosophy of prioritising players getting to experience the full story over the possibility of them getting ‘stuck’ at a difficult obstacle in the game came from? Did that stem from personal frustration you have with other games? Do you think this philosophy contended with the existing SH fanbase who were used to the perhaps more unforgiving nature of survival horror conventions?

SAM: I think if you're going to give the player something 'different', you also need to balance that out with a kind of generosity. You can't ask them to meet you halfway and then keep punishing them. It's also very much a truth that the more you make players repeat things, the more you make them stuck, the more they see the illusion -- they start to see the clockwork, the seams of the experience. So it was very important to me that we help players move smoothly through this experience to properly deliver our emotional payload.

Yeah, I think there's definitely a minority who look for a very specific game template and equate difficulty/obfuscation (and the resulting padded game time!) with the kind of survival horror experience. I don't think Shattered Memories was a game for them, in that sense. For me it's all in service of engaging the player. Sometimes challenge can do that. But the classic survival horror template definitely can also take that too far.

I read that Cold Heart turned into SM as Konami had greenlit a SH1 remake, although SM was a reimagining instead. As a result, there seemed to be a little disconnect between the marketing and what the game actually was. What were some of these differences?

SAM: I guess if there was a disconnect ultimately it was that there were probably high up bosses who thought this was a very traditional remake (just with Wii controls?) rather than a reimagining. That was something that I'm not sure was ever run all the way up the chain! But I think generally marketing got that aspect -- we would reference Battlestar Galactica and they liked that comparison. Really the big disconnect was that we'd made a game from the (new) Wii audience and most of the marketing went into positioning it as a 'gamer's game on the Wii.' That was a real missed opportunity to be honest.

What were some of the challenging aspects of making a reimagining with existing characters as opposed to brand new characters? Were there some advantages even?

SAM: I think it was all upside for us. It's great to have something to start with that you can then springboard off of. And a lot of the intent of SH:SM was that we would create a weird Deja Vu for people who *had* played the original -- a sense of things being recognizable but also very different. That was a whole extra level of vibes and emotional responses that we could tap into. This was much more fun than, say, Silent Hill: Origins where it was all downside... there it felt like we were making fan fiction, having to embellish and add small details to an existing story that had no real spare room or need for those embellishments!

Now that there have been many years to reflect, were there any ideas that you wished made it into the game? Or anything you think would have been better to have been changed or removed?

TOMM: Late-ish in development after getting a lot of feedback and considering how consumers might react, I pitched Climax on adding an element of threat and tension to the "normal" world. Nothing like overt combat or enemies, but just something so the player wouldn't feel entirely safe. This didn't go in obviously, but I sometimes wonder how it may have changed initial reactions from players.

(still third question I hit enter accidentally)  Also I wish the western releases of the game didn't have a bug making one ending harder to get than intended.  That's the main regret.

I think the only other SH game to have pushed the series out of its comfort zone as much as you did with SM is PT. Do you think players/critics these days are more accepting of change in their favorite franchises than they were when SM released? How did you feel when you first saw PT? Was there some specific joy in seeing the series you worked on go into a new direction like SM did?

TOMM: PT was the first (only?) SH game I got to experience after leaving Konami and I certainly think it owes something to SHSM. I'm very proud that our game was essentially a "walking simulator" before that term existed, and how favorably it compares to the notable games of that type, when we were charting our course without a map as it were.  On the right day, I do think critics now are more accepting of changes and I think we owe the indie scene for that a bit. Many critics even EXPECT new titles to change up familiar elements, rather than sticking in the same molds.  That said, fans are still fans. When they hear about a strange new mechanic in a series they love, I hope they remember first-person Resident Evil, Yakuza RPG, and maybe SHSM, and give it a fair chance.

SAM: Maybe? We're definitely living through an age of renewed nostalgia and backwards thinking. So many reboots and remakes! So maybe now is the wrong time to push franchises in fresh directions. Which is a shame. But outside that, I think the audience is definitely open to new experiences and the definitions of genres have expanded. P.T. was great -- I loved how it was delivered, the impact on players. To be honest, in all likelihood how things turned out was probably best? I can't imagine the full Silent Hill reboot ending up having the same impact that P.T. (and it's being lost to time!) was able to generate? I definitely appreciated the ways in which P.T. recalled some of the non euclidian domestic stuff we did in our later 'nowhere' sequence, and just that sense of immersion in a domestic space.

What do you think the legacy for SM was? Any lasting effects you feel were left on the series or community, maybe even the horror genre as a whole?

TOMM: (kind of answered a bit above but we'll try). I hope SHSM takes some of the credit for expanding what a "horror" game can be. It was pretty strict beforehand, you had your RE-style actiony games, and your SH-style atmosphere games that that's how the genre was judged. Horror games these days have such a huge range now and it's wonderful. Weird text-driven meta things, or PS1 throwbacks like Signalis. It's great. Horror only works when it surprises you, so I'm glad it all doesn't fit into 2 rigid definitions anymore.

SAM: Clearly a lot of what we did in SH:SM ended up becoming quite standard -- the flight rather than fight gameplay; the sense of open, immersive spaces with no loading; the 'walking simulator' aspects of our storytelling, etc. I couldn't say whether any of that was directly because of SH:SM, or just in the water anyway! I have heard some developers call out SH:SM, so it does sometimes feel like we had an outsized reaction from particular press, or particular groups of developers -- rather than the world at large.

Sam, this is more out of my own curiosity than anything… but I read that you saw similarities in the chase sequences and an experience you had as a child. Apparently you were in Tanzania being chased by baboons around a swimming pool?! I need to know more!!

SAM: Yeah, when we were devving the first vertical slice, I was obsessed with the swimming pool area. The size of it, the dimensions, how the enemies out to flow around it. At the same time I was pushing the animators and artists to have the enemies on all fours, and hairy! This was a challenge as it made the camera very hard to program so it could see the enemy chasing you; and hair was a challenge on that level of tech. But I kept pushing. And everyone was like, 'why is Sam so set on these ideas??' Then one day I remembered and realized it all went back to this time when I lived in Tanzania and as a 5 year old was chased around a swimming pool by a pack of baboons. My memory is the adults just watched and laughed. It was very traumatic! I was trying to recreate that trauma for the players, but after that mini closure, I relented and let the enemies stand on two feet...

What were the best/most fun parts of development for you?

TOMM: The most fun part of development for me was sharing this weird new game with so many people. Climax developed it so that the first 20-30 minutes of the game were our "Vertical Slice" which would be used to sell the game internally. So I would present this to a room full of Konami folks and make a different person answer each opening therapy question, or make key choices along the way, and I had it all choreographed so I knew when to look at a scary image, when to call a random phone number, etc.  This same section of game was then used as our demo at E3 and Gamescom, and watching all those new players giggle at "Have you cheated on a partner?" or realize their neighbor was having a different path through the demo than they did... it's just great seeing an idea come together so perfectly. Climax hit it out of the park and I was glad to be a part of it.

Anything else you’d like to share? I love hearing fun little stories or memories about game development so feel free to let loose!

TOMM: My most frustrating presentation was showing the game in its alpha state to the head of Marketing. I was showing him the Memento you get from the dart board in the bar, and how you could turn it around to view it using the Wii Remote. He got really fixated on the dart board and tried convincing me we should spend the rest of development making darts playable.  People lose all kinds of time in GTA playing darts and stuff.  He was relentless.  I kept trying to explain the player's mindset in a horror game is different than in GTA but he kept pushing.  Needless to say we did not make darts playable.

SAM: Ooh, I don't know... um.... how about that the clinic where Kaufmann works was inspired by Frank Lloyd Wright's Falling Water building? I gave the artists a bunch of photos of this classic piece of architecture for how I wanted the lighthouse clinic to look. It was only when someone then pointed it out to me that I learned the other name for this famous building? "The Kaufmann house". Mind blown.

Apart from the playable darts, were there any other odd ideas put forward outside of the team during development? Or any other instances where you had to protect the vision for SM?

SAM: I guess we were always on the backfoot in terms of not having traditional combat (or wiimote waving crowbar action) so that was one we had to keep running defense on. Mostly we were so busy executing on all the ideas we did have that we didn't really have too much time to entertain additional ideas, so we just kept moving! Stuff like ensuring that every element of the environment was readable/made sense in the narrative/imagery, etc. was something that was a real and constant effort -- the kind of detail and involvement of the narrative team across the art that just wasn't something you normally did.

A HUGE thank you to them both for participating in the interview!! You can find them on twitter:

Tomm: https://twitter.com/Hypnocrite

Sam: https://twitter.com/mrsambarlow

#silenthill #interview

The Mystery Flesh Pit National Park RPG

The official tabletop RPG of the MFPNP website.

Over a year in the making! If you are into Tabletop Gaming, consider backing! 

the vibes are immaculate

Now that these were all mailed out to the preorder people, everyone else can get them again!