Read An Article About Repressed Anger And I'm Kinda Just Messed Up Because I Checked All 15 Boxes.

Reclaiming post!

hii I am going to be reclaiming the HC-DID term for programmed systems since the person that made it is an awful antisemitic conspirator.

HC-DID means "highly complex DID". It is a term for ramcoa survivors that were programmed to have DID. It exists because the experiences between a programmed system is different than those of CDID systems that aren't programmed.

HC-DID is NOT meant to be a trauma olympics term, it is just a modifier to differentiate the experiences that programmed systems have.

Hello! I keep looking for resources on how to know if you've experienced DBMC but a lot of what I've read so far is confusing or really detailed in what drugs are used but not the aftermath effects for a person who has experienced DBMC.

We're already a C-DID system questioning HC-DID after a subsystem of alters accidentally gave us vague memories that imply DBMC. Could you maybe give insight into what a person would experience after DBMC aside from having alters that behave drugged? Thank you!

There are a few studies about this but most of them are about the drug itself. I will continue by pulling from our own experiences and nothing else.

The effects on alters depend on the substance used and for what. Some drugs aid relaxation, some worsen anxiety or pain, some are hallucinogens, and so on. Perps can use these substances in addition to torture, instead of it, or as their own application.

Narco progs are often done with something to sedate the fronter. This could be a drug made for sleep, a medication known to cause that side effect, an allergen that knocks them out after exposure. One purpose can be achieved with whatever they have on hand, and some perps are specific and educated when it comes to DBMC.

Awake progs are the opposite, some kind of stimulant effect. Progs can be mood centric, specific or broad behaviors, anything. Depending on an alter’s use, they may be kept in a substance-specific state as their baseline or be cues into it.

Betas may be constantly bubbly, lacking impulse control, unable to encode memories. Thetas may be cued into trance or out-of-body experiences. Both of these can be done primarily or entirely with substances.

Conditioning could look more like a torture-based route, with a repetitive cue and a release of dopamine upon completion. When drugs are used like torture, they may cause pain that will be stopped upon finishing the task.

The aftereffects of DBMC are different depending on what exactly was done. It can look like alters perpetually in a state, alters with barely any memory of the state, most of the possibilities for TBMCed alters.

This didn’t feel helpful to write, but idk if I can do any better. If you have a slightly different question or something else entirely, I can try again another way. Good luck y’all!

Always judging

Fun Trauma Things :)

Feeling betrayed when people defend or sympathize with your abuser(s)

Severe abandonment issues

Constantly questioning if you deserved the abuse

Am I actually a terrible person or am I just internalizing things my abuser(s) have said to me??

Purposefully seeking out toxic relationships to further destroy your mental health

Restoring to destructive coping mechanisms because you never learned how to self-soothe

Having a panic attack when someone raises their voice at you

Constantly reinventing yourself because you’re paranoid about turning into your abuser(s)

Never being completely certain which memories are real

Difficulty creating and maintaining close relationships due to trust issues

Tons of uncertainty regarding your religious identity

What if I’m just faking everything for attention?

Fluctuating between hating yourself and hating your abuser(s)

Hypersexuality and other forms of sexual dysfunction

Craving abuse and mistreatment and despising yourself for it

Denying yourself love and comfort because you want to suffer alone and you don’t even deserve it anyways

Picking up on the slightest change of tone in someone’s voice

Projecting the mentality of your abuser(s) onto everyone you know, because if one person who you’re close with can hurt you, so can every other person too!

Maybe I was the abuser all along? Maybe I’m just being manipulative and selfish and I’m actually a horrible abusive monster??

Minuscule, insignificant things reminding you of The Bad Memories and inducing a mental breakdown

Wishing your abuser(s) had just killed you instead of leaving you alive to suffer for the rest of your life

Dissociating for weeks on end, then suddenly having an explosive meltdown because you spilled your cereal

Feeling angry at everyone around you for never noticing the blatantly obvious symptoms of early-onset trauma

Persistent feelings of worthlessness, because if your abuser(s) don’t love you, it must mean you’re completely unlovable

Connecting the dots between traumatic memories and mental health issues you have while psychoanalyzing yourself in the shower

Inescapable suicidal thoughts at all times, always

If you need me I’ll be collecting bruises

Do you know any credible sources on “programming” specifically? I am unclear on the actual definition, I think I went through some things that could be described that way but I don’t understand the difference between “programming” and “grooming” trafficking victims. I previously have only really heard explanations on what programming supposedly is from untrustworthy, conspiracy-ish sources talking about like government mind-control in pop music, but I don’t want to disregard the whole concept if there is better information or research on it.

The term "programming", as I understand it, has fallen out of academic favor due to the connections you mention. Because of this, its definition is somewhat fluid, but I'd generally define programming as:

"The process of using trauma-induced dissociation to implant specific sets of instructions, messages, learned associations, and triggers to produce desired behavior in a victim. It is, at its essence, an extreme form of conditioning, and relies on the use of dissociated parts (alters) to effectively control the victim's mind."

Another source, ra-info.org (one of the oldest sites about RAMCOA on the internet) puts it this way:

"Programming refers both to the process of teaching part of the mind unquestioned obedience and to the content of what is taught. Thus you can say that a person has been programmed to suicide under certain conditions, or you can talk about a suicide program that is triggered (activated) by certain words or conditions."

Grooming for trafficking purposes may or may not use programming methods, as programming requires a level environmental control that not all situations can muster. Programming also typically involves... Well, weirder, more intense stuff. For example, most trafficking operations are not going to use spin programming, but rely more on basic cause & effect. Additionally, grooming may have more of a focus on positive reinforcement, while programming typically doesn't.

And programming is just one end of a large spectrum that encompasses many forms of conditioning, grooming, and abuse; some cases may have some elements of programming (like manipulating dissociative responses to create alters) while not having the structure necessary to do a good job of it. (That's what our case looked like!) Trafficking organizations may not have the money, access, space, or time to implement full programs.

But sources that mention programming by name do exist, and most give their own definition of programming. I'll throw them under a cut because this post is already getting long.

Dialogues With Forgotten Voices by Harvey Schwartz (2000). Generally a great resource so far, I haven't read all of it but what I have gone through is enlightening. Programming is mentioned all through the book but 330 is where more specifics are discussed. Index starts at page 499 so you can peruse topics by your own discretion. His other book, The Alchemy of Wolves & Sheep, covers similar ground (RAMCOA) but with a unique focus (forced perpetration). It's in my pinned post.

Both of Alison Miller's Books, Healing the Unimaginable (2011) and Becoming Yourself (2014). Many survivors swear by these books, and they use the term "programming" throughout. I haven't read these yet but you'll see them referenced constantly.

Safe Passage to Healing by Chrystine Oksana (1994). Another "classic", another book I haven't touched yet. Discusses programming quite a bit and is meant for survivors.

Many of Steven Hassan's works use programming in a slightly more "casual" manner from what I can see—referring to brainwashing at any age in the contexts of cults, as that's Hassan's focus—but helpful for many regardless.

Spin Programming: A Newly Uncovered Technique of Systematic Mind Control by John Lovern (1993) and Common Programs Observed in Survivors of Satanic Ritualistic Abuse by Neswald, Gould, and Graham-Costain (1991). Lumping these together despite the different authors because they're in my "I can't 100% trust these but the information is, in general, useful and many survivors share these" category. The first also includes sketches by survivors, but we're partial to the second one because we don't have spin programming.

On top of this list, there are HUNDREDS of sources that do not use the term "programming" but regardless, refer to similar processes. Too many to list. I hope this is a good starting point though!

Human Bill of Rights

GUIDELINES FOR FAIRNESS AND INTIMACY

1. I have the right to be treated with respect.

2. I have the right to say no.

3. I have the right to make mistakes.

4. I have the right to reject unsolicited advice or feedback.

5. I have the right to negotiate for change.

6. I have the right to change my mind or my plans.

7. I have a right to change my circumstances or course of action.

8. I have the right to have my own feelings, beliefs, opinions, preferences, etc.

9. I have the right to protest sarcasm, destructive criticism, or unfair treatment.

10. I have a right to feel angry and to express it non-abusively.

11. I have a right to refuse to take responsibility for anyone else's problems.

12. I have a right to refuse to take responsibility for anyone's bad behavior.

13. I have a right to feel ambivalent and to occasionally be inconsistent.

14. I have a right to play, waste time and not always be productive.

15. I have a right to occasionally be childlike and immature.

16. I have a right to complain about life's unfairness and injustices.

17. I have a right to occasionally be irrational in safe ways.

18. I have a right to seek healthy and mutually supportive relationships.

19. I have a right to ask for a modicum of help and emotional support.

20. I have a right to complain and verbally ventilate in moderation.

21. I have a right to grow, evolve and prosper.

http://www.pete-walker.com/humanBillofRights.htm

Adhd really is like... bedroom is slightly messy it would be nice to tidy it some

bedroom is very messy I really should tidy up

bedroom is chaotic I NEED to tidy but my brain says no. Why. Whyyy.

I guess I’ll just have to watch where I step in here for the rest of my life. The mess is everywhere. I’m one with the mess.

A sudden Need to Clean™ makes you get the room looking like some fancy homes magazine cover, and you think “I’ll never ever let it get that bad again, and then...

bedroom is slightly messy (uh oh)

I would not suggest the deprogrammed wiki, lots of miss information there, but there is some true stuff there too. Just wanted to add that! 

RAMCOA* Resources

Trigger warning: the content on these websites contain discussions of rape, abuse, and trauma-based mind control. PLEASE be careful with yourself, especially if you’re a survivor.

Survive’s page on ritual abuse

General information, does not include information about mind control. Aimed at survivors and allies.

BRISSC’s page on ritual abuse

General information, does not include information about mind control. Aimed at survivors and allies.

RAMCOA Resources Carrd

A very thorough resource on RA and mind control. Contains information on different types of programmed alters and their terms, a general definition of ritual abuse and TBMC, common trigger dates for survivors, and what you can do to help. Aimed at allies. The information here can possibly be triggering if you are a survivor or suspect you are a survivor.

endritualabuse.org

A vast site on ritual abuse and mind control, created by a psychologist who has worked with survivors of RA. Contains information, words from survivors to survivors, and symptom lists of survivors, mostly intended for therapists and professionals. As a survivor, I have found many helpful things for recovery on this site, but please be careful on which articles you read. The information part of this site is very thorough and can possibly be triggering if you are a survivor or suspect you are a survivor.

Deprogram Wiki

This is a site that is a gold mine for information on detecting if someone is a victim of TBMC and programming, the different types of programmed alters, and, specifically for therapists or professionals, how to deprogram someone who has been a victim of RAMCOA. HEAVY TRIGGER WARNING — this site is NOT intended for survivors at all and can be extremely triggering.

*RAMCOA - an acronym that stands for Ritual Abuse, Mind Control, and Organized Abuse.

Things we as a RAMCOA survivor want non-survivors to know

This is going to be emotional but this has also been a long time coming. Most of our 34 drafts on this account have been on this topic and today something happened that was just the last straw for us. If you are not a survivor sit the fuck down and shut the fuck up. It's our turn now. You are privileged comparatively on this regard- whether you like it or not.

Do not silence RAMCOA survivors in favor of people with "false memories"

I have no idea why this is something that needs to be said because you would assume it would be common decency but apparently a lot of non-RAMCOA survivors seem to be completely unaware of how fucked up it is to say.

Not only has false memory syndrome been thoroughly debunked- but the only time someone has anything close is when they have a disorder that makes them prone to delusions. In which case that is a delusion. Stop blaming survivors who are working to recover and possibly save the lives of others who currently as you read this are actively being tortured, for a disorder that most people are born with and has literally nothing to do with us. Stop using "some people have delusions" as a backhanded way to harm RAMCOA survivors.

I am sick and tired of people making it clear they care far more about people with "false memories" than they do for real torture survivors.

Do not tell a RAMCOA survivor to their face you have had false memories of the torture they actively endured. It is incredibly insensitive and is a mockery of the torture they experienced.

And if one more "person" makes the claim that RAMCOA survivors talking about our experiences, the things that were done to us and others, is putting people with a disorder we didn't cause in danger- I will snap. We didn't give anyone a disorder- we didn't manifest your fucking delusions. You can work through your delusions in therapy- we have physical and mental injuries that will never fully heal from our REAL experience. It is such a disgusting and selfish thing to do. You are not allies- you are harming all survivors.

Stop telling RAMCOA survivors to never look into things

It's funny how this is often done in order to try and aid and help us, considering not having the terminology almost got us killed.

Non-ramcoa survivors telling RAMCOA survivors that talking about RAMCOA is dangerous and they should never look into it are actively harming programmed systems by triggering silence programs and making them self-destruct and get less access to aid, community, and terminology to be able to explain experiences to a medical professional and there has been little to no proof that learning about RAMCOA has ever killed a RAMCOA survivor.

People who push this idea that "it's too dangerous for you :((" and shut down all ramcoa survivors and then try to destroy our community terms like HC-DID (highly complex; this is used to described programmed systems that are polyfragmented and their complex structures) because of some idea of being a glorious savior to us- are just being incredibly selfish and insensitive. It has never been about helping us, not ever. It has been about you and people like you wanting to feel like you're oh so cool and good and special. That you "really care" about the likes of the poor weak incapable RAMCOA survivors.

We don't need to be babied. We fucking crawled out of the bowels of hell itself and have been through things that people often don't survive. Some of us have to fight programs every day- before and after knowing about our survivor status. Omega programming didn't start when we learned about RAMCOA- it first kicked off when we were nine years old. You failing to educate yourselves on the way programming functions yet insisting on speaking for us and people like us is infuriating. We are not children and even the ones that are do not fucking need you to baby them.

The only people we have ever seen proclaim talking about how "speaking on RAMCOA is bad and dangerous!!!!" are one of two groups; Non ramcoa-survivors speaking for us, and RAMCOA survivors with a program actively causing them to say this. In case you don't know much about programming, there is programs that make you try and silence both yourself and other people. This is one of the most well known types of programs. I am sorry to say this but we genuinely believe that most if not all RAMCOA survivors saying this are having a program run.

People pushing this message onto us literally triggered our silence program for so long we couldn't say much to our therapist until we learned terminology. It took that for us to be put on a disappearance watch list. This community idea could have gotten us killed. We were in literal danger because we could not manage to tell our therapist about our experiences because others had said the very same words our abusers did. "Don't tell anyone."

RAMCOA perpetrators do fucking everything they can to make sure we never speak. You are aiding abusers by contributing to our silence and you are possibly sending people to die. This is not a thing I can be lighthearted about. This is something that has made our system have alters that deeply hate and despise anyone who contributed to it with us and the same to anyone who may have done so to others.

Edit: For those who struggle to interpret this- no we never said you should randomly spur of the moment look into RAMCOA with no safety nets. That should be common sense. We also literally never said that anywhere. I don't know why people are so incapable to read what we say. We're autistic we say what we mean.