FFVII Remake Easter Eggs And Compilation Continuity - Part 6: THE KIDS ARE ALRIGHT: A TURKS SIDE STORY

FFVII Remake Easter Eggs - Part 2

SPOILER ALERT! Spoilers about the FFVII compilation.

FFVII Remake includes a lot of Easter eggs referring to the whole FF7 compilation. This is the second post, and it will include the references to…

Crisis Core is a PSP game released in 2007. It’s a prequel to FFVII and focuses on the adventures of Zack Fair.

1. RUDE BEING…RUDE.

“Haven’t seen him before. He your new boy toy?” Rude is referring to Zack, Aerith’s boyfriend at the time of Crisis Core. Very…rude though (Chapter 8).

2. THE PUPPY

- Angeal used to refer to Zack as a puppy.

- Stamp the dog is a new misterious element added in the Remake. He’s a beagle, but at the end of the game, when Zack survives, we see it changing in a terrier.

Are you Zack the puppy? My son wrote to me once about you, zero attention span, restless as a little puppy.

3. BANORA WHITE

- There are some billboards of “Banora White” apple juice in Midgar.

- These fruits only grow in Banora, and the juice was invented by Genesis.

4. DATING

Aerith asks Cloud to be her bodyguard in exchange for one date. Yes, this was already in the original FFVII but the gesture is taken from Crisis Core (Chapter 8).

5. SELLING FLOWERS

- Zack suggested Aerith to sell flowers and they started selling them together in Evergreen Park.

- Aerith and Cloud arrive in Evergreen Park and she remembers the time she used to sell flowers there (Chapter 9).

You know, a long time ago, I used to sell flowers here.

6. YOUR EYES

In Chapter 9 Aerith stares at Cloud’s beautiful eyes the same way she did with Zack. In Japanese Zack and Cloud answer with the same sentence.

7. PINK DRESS

- Zack asked Aerith to wear something pink when they would have met again.

- The pink dress has always been Aerith’s distinctive mark since 1997, but her optional outfits in the Remake, that were not in the original FFVII, are pink too (Chapter 9).

From now on, why don’t we make a promise every time we meet? (…) For example, when we meet, you always have to dress in pink.

8. TRAINING ROOM

- The training room was a virtual reality simulator used by SOLDIERs in Crisis Core.

- Cloud, Tifa and Barret find a battle simulator in Shinra HQ in Chapter 16.

9. PROJECT S AND PROJECT G

- Hojo says he wants to breed Aerith with S and G type SOLDIERS.

- In Nibelheim Mako reactor Genesis told Sephiroth about Project S and Project G. The first gave birth to Sephiroth, the second to Angeal and Genesis. Project G was also used to create Deepground SOLDIERs (Chapter 16).

CC: “Jenova project G gave birth to Angeal and monsters like myself. Jenova project S used the remains of countless failed experiments to create a perfect monster.” 

FF7R: “We could have the Ancient reproduce. (…) I would start with candidates from SOLDIER. These would of course include S and G types.”

10. CELLULAR DEGRADATION

- Genesis was a failed experiment and his body kept degrading irreversibly.

- In Chapter 7 President Shinra, after noticing that Cloud is a SOLDIER, points out that SOLDIERs usually die pretty soon because of cellular degradation.

Once a SOLDIER, always a SOLDIER. Though not, alas, for very long. Accelerated cellular degradation being the most common cause of death by far.

11. KUNSEL

- Kunsel was a SOLDIER and friend of Zack.

- When some infantrymen see Cloud and recognize him they say they’ll go and call Kunsel (Chapter 16).

Cloud? You’re Cloud, right? (…) We went through training together. (…) Hey, sit tight man – I'mma go get Kunsel.

12. BARRET’S LAST STAND

“Worst route ever. Gimme a suicidal last stand. At least– At least–at least that’d have an end!” Barret says this sentence while climbing Shinra backstairs, at 49th floor – SOLDIERs floor. It’s a reference to Zack’s last stand (Chapter 16).

13. FREEDOM

Before entering in the dimensional portal Aerith says that beyond it there’s “Freedom. Boundless, terrifying freedom”. It reconnects with Zack’s iconic sentence before his last stand “The price of freedom is steep” (Chapter 18).

14. THE SKY

- In Crisis Core Aerith told Zack that the real sky frightened her.

- At the end of the Remake Aerith says “I miss it. The steel sky”, referring the upper plate that covered the real sky. In Japanese she says “The  sky…I hate it”, because it took away from her Zack and her mother. (Chapter 18).

15. THE DEFEAT OF DESTINY

- Zack had a dream in Crisis Core that foreshadowed his death. He was looking at the sky wishing to have wings like Angeal.

- In the Remake he defeats his destiny and looks at the sky in the same position (Chapter 18).

16. ZACK’S LAST STAND

This iconic scene is replicated shot-for-shot in Chapter 18

PART 1 (BEFORE CRISIS)

PART 3 (ADVENT CHILDREN)

PART 4 (DIRGE OF CERBERUS)

PART 5 (ON THE WAY TO A SMILE)

PART 6 (THE KIDS ARE ALRIGHT: A TURKS SIDE STORY)

PART 7 (PICTURING THE PAST)

PART 8 (FINAL FANTASY VII - 1)

PART 9 (FINAL FANTASY VII - 2)

PART 10 (EXTRAS)

My response to someone asking me to clarify why I say Cloud can't have been in love with Aerith after only 36 hours yet he loved Tifa as a little kid when they never even interacted. Isn't that hypocritical?

This is divided into 3 parts for clarity like my original comment.

Part 2: Gonna split this reply in 2 parts for  clarity

Pt 1 Clarifying  my point on Cloud's feelings for both girls

The point I brought up is that Cloud start to fall for Aerith eventually yes (that's  why she says you  can't  fall in love with me) but  her reference was of the original game because she knows of the future.  She doesn't mean in that moment.  He has no idea what  she's talking about there but  says she  can't decide that for  him. But it's not  forever  love in the span of two days. She also  says even if he thinks he has it's not real/in his imagination.  Alluding to his identity crisis. He may think  he's in love but there's stuff going on he's  unaware of.

It's not  forever love with Tifa during the game either though not even during Highwind scene. That's the beginning of their feelings being realized. Their feelings also need time to grow and figure themselves out. But Cloud actually gets that time with Tifa because at the end of the game they confess mutual feelings and live together less than three months later. There's plenty of time for development. Unlike with Aerith there wasn't time for it to go further not  that his feelings stopped cold. He just never  time to figure them out before the guilt took over.

He did interact more than once with Tifa they used to see eachother around. They were not close. She watched  him from afar. Cloud just  never  approached but he watched her too. And 16 years old Cloud and 16 years old Tifa liking eachother is canon in Crisis Core and shown in Last Order. Again he falls for  her like  a kid would but  over  a much  longer period of time. 8 years. And these are feelings he still has. It's puppy love. Of course 8 year old isn't going to fall in love for real. It isn't forever love but  definitely a start.

As I said Cloud acts like a kid when it comes to his feelings. He doesn't comprehend them and that's  big part of his character even before his mind broke. That's why 2 days wouldn't mean forever love with Aerith when heck 8 years later he was still struggling with coming to terms  for his feelings for Tifa in Crisis Core.

He's still can't vocalize them in the present and his true self and memories are locked off that's why it's hard to explain.

He doesn't really  understand until the Highwind Scene and in Case Of Tifa and he voices it  and he's still struggling with all sorts of feelings in AC not neccessarily romantic ones. He even  struggles with his fatherly feelings towards Marlene. Heck being happy with Tifa and the children when Aerith  and Zack are dead causes guilt so bad he runs away. Feelings aren't his forte. And the trauma that he's gone through as young as age 9 when he fell off a friggin mountain and was blamed for trying to save a girl precious to him and after that losing those he held dear over and over again doesn't help.

He's a character that takes a lot of time to emotionally come to terms with things especially things like romantic love. So no what he had with Aerith is something he never figured out because he was oblivious. And he is so wrapped up in guilt in AC it probably confused him more.

It takes regular people time to really fall in love. Short term love is infatuation when we don't know someone yet. Now apply it to a character like Cloud who doesn't deal with feelings like regular people. It's unrealistic to say he loves anyone after knowing them for what is basically 36 hours during that scene.

Cloud having the mentality of a 16 year old is the present Cloud. Nomura himself says it. I posted the interview about Remake. Here it is again https://www.inverse.com/gaming/ff7-remake-interview-story-changes-cloud-jessie-wall-market

Part 2: Literally no time has passed for  Cloud between the Nibelheim incident and the events of the story. 16 year old Cloud is the present.

Zack dies in September Tifa finds Cloud between then and December. December  9  is the first bombing he meets Aerith two days later and dies weeks later Meteor fall is in January. Case of Tifa starts in March. Advent Children is 2 years later.

Biggs says it too he says Cloud and the children have so much in common.

Or do you think Cloud mentally caught up after 5 years of being in a mako coma after just a month? No, story wise in the present he's 16. Nomura even says that's why Jesse teases him. He's mentally 16 the whole time.

Cloud realizing his feelings for Tifa is what happens in the Lifestream scene of the game AFTER Aerith's death.  But he obviously is still crushing on her in Remake. The devs said when he's with  Tifa his True self  comes out so that's why.

His 21 year old self couldn't have gotten over Tifa because his last memory before joining AVALANCHE is Zack's death and his last memory that he can actually recall is finding Tifa in the reactor and thinking she's dead. That's yesterday for him. He meets Aerith a few days after waking up and seeing Tifa again.

Aerith dies less than four weeks after meeting her.

Then he finds out about his true self which IS his 16year old self.

That self has feelings for Tifa. That Cloud is literally unlocked in the Lifestream sequence and that's why the developers themselves say in more than one quote that Cloud and Tifa have held favor for eachother for many years before he calls her two the water tower a popular date spot. This was even before they spoke only once as you put it. And the devs go on to say they reveal mutual feelings beneath the Highwind then live together in Advent Children.

This is why in Case of Tifa Cloud is telling her he has her now and now he knows what that means and he always be there to remind her of herself. This is also why Tifa is asking Do You Love Me? And Nojima mentions things not going well in Case of Tifa but maybe the kids can help them work it out. He didn't  want to give opinions  on love marriage and family. Because they were going through relationship issues. Three years later they're still together.

For a timeline reference Cloud liked Tifa since he was a kid

At age 8 he goes to Mt. Nibel with her

At age 14 he calls her to water tower still likes her

At age 16 he hides from her in his mom's house because he still likes her

That scene where Cloud's mom is talking about girls? He's currently hiding from Tifa in that scene because he's ashamed of facing her because he didn't join SOLDIER.

Tifa however is looking for him and in Crisis Core she keeps asking Zack about him

Tifa had a crush on Cloud from afar too but neither of them realized their feelings

That's why they call eachother childhood friends Tifa WANTED to be closer and befriend him

And of course so did he so he rationalized it in his broken mind. Guess we were friends...

During the reactor sequence which is a few days after leaving his mom's house Sepiroth burns the town

Cloud finds Tifa thinks she's dead and it causes him to kill Sepiroth in rage

He still had it bad for Tifa in that scene Zack had pointed it out earlier

Then he's skewered and captured for experimentation right there

He doesn't wake up until 5 years later during Zack's death

Then he wanders around broken for almost 2 months and finds Tifa again.

Seeing her makes the Jenova cells activate and that's why he thinks he's a SOLDIER because she thinks he is and Scells use memories to manipulate

He forgets Zack and anything related to his true self and his true self is locked behind his memories.

His memories of Tifa are also mostly locked

So yes that's why Cloud doesn't show as much interest in Tifa during the time he is SOLDIER! Cloud as 16 year old Cloud does.

He meets Aerith slowly warms up to her as she draws him out of his shell

And eventually they grow closer

She senses his true self is in there somewhere and tells him during their date but he doesn't understand

She goes off to fight Sepiroth alone because she realizes that something is very wrong with Cloud and she doesn't want him to suffer a breakdown

But he does anyway when Sepiroth shows him the real memories he locked away then lied to him

He falls back into Mako poisoning after being in the Lifestream and his then Tifa pieces his broken mind together using their childhood memories the real ones

True Cloud is now back and for him the Nibelheim incident was yesterday and for him he's still 16 years old and his feelings for Tifa that were locked with him  return

That's why the devs talk about them realizing mutual feelings in the Highwind scene.

Case of Tifa starts

That's why things work out like they do. The song Midgar Blues allude to True Cloud's past with Tifa and refer to their feelings. the eng English official version says "left my true love behind". The devs say they held favor for eachother for many years before before even meeting at the water tower.

That's also why Nomura and Nojima say Cloud in the remake is mentally a kid trying to be an adult and why he tries to be cool and why he wants to hug Tifa during her resolution, And why Biggs tells him he has so much in common with the kids.  He wants to be adult like, but  he doesn't realize he literally lost 5 years of his life.

This would not magically change when he met  Aerith a few days later.

The entire game 1.5months after waking up again. He meets Aerith less than a week after Tifa finds him. He has literally no time to be anything other than 16 year old Cloud.

This is just going off  official  material

Next part is my summary in my own words

Part 3

Everything I have written above is what the devs themselves have said.  It's all official  statements.  Not my opinion. As for  a summary in my own words on what it all means.

Tifa is Cloud's past but  she's also his present.  The easiest way to think of it is Cloud's  true personality as another side of himself. because this story follows the Gnostic  ideas of two competing selves. Cloud's  16 year self is his current self but he is unaware.

The reason a lot of people think Tifa is the past is because they don't understand that Cloud acting as SOLDIER Cloud is the one who fell for  Aerith. And that really complicates things. 

Real Cloud was in there but  locked off in his subconscious.

Aerith saw through him but  Real Cloud doesn't actually come back until the end.

SOLDIER Cloud and Real Cloud are not the same. They're essentially two personalities seperate from eachother. But  because of JENOVA's manipulation it's also as if Cloud himself was split into  two people. When True Cloud is in the LifeStream scene he tells Tifa  "Then... this is goodbye, Tifa. Until we meet again......". When he wakes up he says  "Yeah...... Tifa...... We finally...... meet again......". Because True Cloud wasn't actually present until that moment beyond his subconscious.

He was locked away until Tifa literally Lock Heart unlocked him.

It's Nomura and Sakaguchi and Nojima and Kitase after all.

The Gnostic theme here is of two selves fighting for control and causing inner turmoil. Unless one reaches their Tifaret on the path of Sepiroth these selves will stay at war and the the self will be a false self that can't reach it's Final Heaven. This is based on ideas of enlightenment in Kabbalistic mysticism and its what the lore of FF7 is about. Gnostic themes in general are a really big part of SquareEnix games.

And if anyone  wants  a source for anything I have said here feel  free to ask. I have reciepts it would just make this post too long if I post them all at once.

The truth is a lot of us played this when we were young and a lot of stuff went over our heads but Final Fantasy VII is as complicated and mature as Xenogears and has similar lore. It was never a simple adventure and romance story, there's A LOT going on. Basically the Cloud we see in the game until the LifeStream scene is essentially a fake self and we learn the mystery of that through the narrative.

Now it's been confirmed the Remake is canon to the Compilation so it's going to be a lot clearer especially in terms of the Gnostic themes. They're bringing back their original ideas about the Thermaturge too.

Why Tifa is the only person, living or dead, who can resolve Cloud’s crisis

Alternate title: “What really happened in the Lifestream”

Of course the Lifestream scene has been discussed to death within the fandom. While some consider it one of the greatest triumphs of the Cloud/Tifa relationship and the game in general, others are quick to diminish its events and Tifa’s role. “Oh, any other childhood friend character who knew Cloud could do the job.” “Oh, Cloud only needed Tifa as moral support, he could have figured everything out himself.” “Oh, Aerith (maybe +Zack) could have done it by accessing her Cetra/time machine/empath/Planet powers.”

The Lifestream sequence is extraordinarily dense with many subtle visual cues, so there’s a lot to untangle and interpret. But no matter how you slice it, any take which downplays or eliminates Tifa is fundamentally missing the point of this scene, both for the plot and for Cloud’s character arc.

A lot of the confusion stems from a fundamental misunderstanding of what actually needs to happen in the Lifestream and why. Thus, using specific details from the sequence, I’d like to present my take on the following:

Part 1: What Cloud needs to accomplish in the Lifestream to advance the plot

Part 2: Why Tifa is the only person, living or dead, who can resolve Cloud’s crisis, where we will discuss fun things such as:

Why Tifa is the the focus of his greatest flaw

What Tifa’s presence in the Lifestream accomplishes

Part 3: Why those “Tifa-less” fan theories just can’t work

This is a very long ride so let’s get to it!

Continua a leggere

Facts.

I love the Kyrie sidequests because every time Cloud rolls up and goes "Stop that. You're disgracing the noble and honorable occupation of being a mercenary." and then proceeds to fix boilers and find lost chickens

TIFA, AERITH AND BARRET IN-GAME SCHOOL UNIFORM SKINS

SOMEONE IS FINALLY SAYING THIS

i see it's that time of the year again where people start hating on the english localization of remake/rebirth despite having next to no understanding of how large scale translation projects work 🙃

I'm still a beginner in Japanese but maybe I can help (anyway, take me with a grain of salt).

Here there are some etymological info about Wutai and Da Chao.

As the link says, the literal meaning of 五台 is "five plateaus" both in Chinese and in Japanese. In Japanese the name of the mount is written in the same way but it's pronounced the japanese way, ごだい godai (in both languages 五 means "5" and 台 means "platform"). Anyway, in the game Wutai is written in katakana (which is usually the writing system used for foreign words), keeping the original Chinese pronounce ウータイ.

I checked some pictures of Da-Chao statue and it seems it's formed by only 4 figures, but in the pagoda quest Yuffie has to fight against five different enemies (and other meanings of 台 are "elevated area" and "level"), so maybe that's indeed the reference.

Anyway - side note - the names of the 4 fighters and Godo himself have nothing to do with Japanese/Chinese cultures or Buddhism, they actually derive from the names of western playwrights: Gorki, Shake, Chekov, Staniv, Godo. Fandom links the origin of Da-Chao to a Tibetan temple but following this logic it could be linked to something that has nothing to do with Buddhism as well. It's written in katakana so it's difficult to trace the potential chinese etymology.

As for Fort Tamblin, タンブリン in Japanese means "tambourine".

Wutai names - etymology

FFVII scholars, can you help?

There’s a sacred mountain in Shangxi Province, China, called Mt Wutai. This may be where SE got the name for the land of Wutai in FFVII, or it may not, and I don’t know what the characters 五台 mean in Chinese, but we do know Wutai is the name of a real place, like Costa del Sol. 

But what about Fort Tamblin, which in Japanese is タンブリン？ Does it mean anything? Is it meant to mean anything? 

And Da Chao? Does it mean something?

As far as I can remember, Fort Tamblin, Da Chao and Wutai proper are the only three locations in Wutai for which we have name. 

Flowers.

Happy Birthday Aerith 🌸

I - 30something yo mom - never looked "adult" once in my life. Draw fanart, play videogames, rant about fictional stories and lores, cosplay, read manga and basically do whatever makes me feel good and I regret nothing.

Being in fandom spaces is so surreal-

Bc once your age hits a 'serious' number, you start to think - "damn, I should probably stop geeking and get more serious." But then you scroll and see a 34y/o woman writing fics after driving her kids to school, a 40y/o dude making fanart of his fav super heroes and you realize - "nah, I'm actually good"