Motown - Blog Posts
On the cover of Tan magazine, September 1965. (Featuring a photo of The Beatles with Mary Wells in October 1964.)
“I’d never really heard Marvin Gaye, The Miracles and all that until George played me the records up in their flat [on London’s Green Street] and they absolutely blew me away. I then went on a sort of crusade for Motown!” - Tony Hall, The Beatles: The BBC Archives
Cathy McGowan: “What records do you like, other than your own?” George Harrison: “All the Motown Tamla records, Mary Wells, Miracles, Marvin Gaye, Impressions, all that crowd.” - Ready, Steady, Go!, March 20, 1964
“[The music] that we play at home — like Mary Wells, Miracles and not to mention Marvin Gaye.” - George Harrison, BBC’s Public Ear, January 12, 1964
“Tamla Motown artists are our favorites. The Miracles, The Impressions, Marvin Gaye, Mary Wells, The Exciters.” - George Harrison, The Beatles’ Detroit press conference, September 6, 1964
“That boy George — he’s very quiet, but he’s cute.” - Mary Wells, Melody Maker, November 7, 1964
“Labeling the various members of the Beatles, Mary [Wells] recalled that Paul McCartney is the ‘real life of any party; Ringo Starr is a complete clown; George Harrison is kind of on the quiet side; and John Lennon is more of a businessman than the other three and he’s the toughest one to get to know.’” - Tan, September 1965
“The Beatles — who were always among Mary’s very early fans — are now her own favorites. She thinks they are very adorable and feels dreadfully sorry for them. ‘You have no idea how surrounded they are. There’s always someone wanting them. Their lives are certainly not their own. You know sometimes Paul or George will come into my dressing room and play a couple of records and then leave again.’” - Disc, October 31, 1964 (x)
I want one of those people who make YouTube playlist videos to make a playlist titled “POV: you live in Michigan” and the entire playlist is just Jimmy Buffet and Motown’s greatest hits.
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The Exo critique/ comparison continues more of a kpop/ western cultural overview though
for educational purposes only of course. So many links. I never did this if it doesn't work I'll just do something else..
I believe a lot of my issues with exo and struggling to appreciate their discography like I do other groups I listened to was the lack of personal touch as I once said. I don't believe I'm being negative or whatever but at this point you literally can't even give your opinion without being called weird Korean slang terms by ironically non korean people..who don't usually speak korean..super weird. I just am tired of it. I feel like there's worse things in the world than someone giving their honest opinion but understandable some people feel extremely attached to bands and shows. Which I kind of get somewhat. But like I always do I will try to give as much detail as possible it's my thing on here. Weird opinions central. None of my friends ever//ever ever really wanted to discuss kpop on a deeper level. I was going mad not being able to express myself to anyone cause nobody knows it that deeply. That sucks so for a lot of people it's a stress reliver and it's aesthetic. I completely understand. But to me there's a million people that give kpop praise, or even rude unhinged hate. I'm not that type of person. I try and be as honest as possible and then sometimes I make a funny. This is more for people who like history than people who like kpop. But some people who like kpop like history, theories and deep diving. So I just tag relevant things and if you don't like reading that much..you..don't have to..which is kinda obvious. Also if opinions not harming anyone makes you mad, that's fine, but just don't..freak out. Or do. Idk, it's a free world, but the main reason I talk so much is because I care. I want to live in a world where everyone can express themselves respectfully and intently. That will only happen if we start speaking on things nobody wants to speak on. I try and only talk about confirmed stuff that's free real estate on the internet. So it's not a just trust me bro situation. This is stuff anybody can dig into and if it's my opinion I will make that clear.
If I never branched out and read/watched random documentaries etc I wouldn't know any of this stuff either. Many people spend most of their time scrolling may as well teach something while I'm on here.
WARNING I TALK A LOT..so you already know before I keep going
To me I like to stretch back to this infamous quote because it ties in with what I was talking about with the motown inspirations and such
A Motown alum with many
Grammy's and a history with Quincy Jones, Michael Jackson to me was Lee Soo man's main inspirations for what he wants his S.m artists to be. The entire kpop industry is built off of that model. In the U.S the inspiration is great but I believe in Korea it's what the foundation is built off of almost entirely.
The want to create someone beyond a human being, with a devout fanbase and global success. The indie music industry is barely thought of or given much attention, the rap industry takes a backseat and the idol culture reins supreme.
But why?
I believe many misunderstand that although Micheal Jackson is the name used he himself is used as a stand in for the African American race.
The true inspiration is African American culture itself, the jazz, the rhythm and blues, the hip hop, popping and locking, B-boying. But nobody wants to say all that, it isn't Michael Jackson but he is a representative of the African American population so of course they use his name, because that's what everybody says.
Lsm's first artist was in fact a hip hop star, the large majority of 90s idols were reflections of artists like boys II men, who is a big blueprint for the white American boy band and later the K-pop boy band
They were clearly and unapologetically black people. The market allowed for glitz and glam and also for performers who were toned down.
With K-pop the market is extremely geared towards the Michael Jackson type of performance extremely theatrical and to this day that's where most of the focus is the performance and not really the vocals.
Lsm's first artist had a different experience than other k-pop idols later would. In the begining things were a bit more loose, still heavily western inspired but relaxed
To understand the way kpop is now you have to understand it's roots, not the superficial this song sounds like these other song, NO, the actual roots of how this industry even exists.
I could go into what was going on in America at the time while all this was happening but I might do a whole seperate thing on that. The asian american experience during the 80s and 90s had more to do with assimilating into white culture, while trying to distance itself from black culture almost entirely.
Meanwhile in Korea, things where changing in the opposite direction.
Now, stick with me, taking all of this into account looking at Exo's trainee process which for some members was right when the hip hop industry was at it's height/also the white boy singing black music craze was also very popular. From a business standpoint of course they want to promote a group that's hip hop inspired. After the incident with Hyun-jin it's clear they may have wanted to distance themself from the urban scene and cater to different audiences.
When Exo debuted they did have that style people were used to from edm, hard base, edm, electronic, not necessarily urban by any means. But they would have a turn in genre for their first full album which featured their first hip hop single Growl.
I consider it old school hip hop, but this is what Rolling Stone said about it
the original sounds like something that could easily be a Corbin Bleu song or something or a very young Chris Brown. This would be one of S.m's first real step back into the urban market with Exo, but it wouldn't be the last
They went full urban with Call Me Baby
and remade this demo to a more tame tune. I believe this is the first but not last sample of a black girlgroup they would use. This song has a sort of sample/reference with the 'say my name' which I believe is still dantaethekid's vocals. This using of the demo's singers vocals and remixing it was used one other time. But it's a blend. If you aren't aware of blending vocals, it's a smooth trick to use the original artist vocals and the new artists vocals to get something that sound like normal to the listener, but when you hear the singer sing it acapella something is missing.
S.m paid for all of this, so it's not stolen. That's not what this is about, it's more of a artistic overview and a behind of what went into creating Exo's themes, concepts and what made their music 'special'.
I had no idea Marz was the person who leaked a lot of the original versions, I knew about the older ones but hearing the demo's and now knowing a bit about the music industry...like hearing the original versions help so so much. Good on him.
I honestly thought black people were capping when they talked about what was going on in Kpop. Because, isn't black culture just uesd by everybody? Like they listen to music and their brain makes something similar. That's what I thought was happening...only partially. There is a whole world of information I didn't know about and I thought I knew a lot.
Now that the basis is out of the way, back to the creative process. I believe an integral part of music lasting has to be the emotional connection one has with the music. If an artist's music catalogue was taken away could they start over, if they didn't have songs made for them could they craft their own, or at least try? In a group that's easier, because members can rely on each other.
Using modern western examples, Justin Bieber certainly started out like many artists, he was handed exactly what he was going to sing. He had very little if any connection to his music at all.
Scooter Braun a former party organizer and the opposite of Lee soo man had connections that helped his young client get started in the music industry
unlike in Korea where many groups may never collab with another artist in their entire career. The west survives off of collabs and hit singles. It's a different system. Justin was helped by a Ludacris feature that gave his sound some validity. It helped him not seem like just a nerdy little kid singing about love.
He did not start off with hip hop and it took years before he developed into a sound he and his voice was comfortable with
But wait..there's another part we're missing. Justin wasn't a songwriter but he was a musician. Let me explain
He was not a composer yet, but he wasn't dead weight, he could play any instrument in a band and sing acapella at random. He even did so in one of his first youtube video's.
there's a lot and you can only put so many links on here but this is one of his busking performances
A common misconception when lumping all artists togther is saying they are all untalented or the label helped them sound like this or that. Anyone can get singing lessons, but if this kind of talent could just be put into anybody to sing like this acapella every parent in hollywood would be doing it. Every performer, disney kid would sound exactly like this. Justin was helped by the fact that he didn't need tremendous work on his voice. Only to maintain when he began touring and learning proper technique.
Sm vocal trainer Yoo Young Jin's first album Blues In Rhythm Single 1. and the demo's he does for sm clearly show his singing inspiration comes from Slow Jamz from the 1990. He helped out on Tell me what is love where D.O mimics his style. It becomes like a pattern when you see where they are pulling inspiration from. In terms of american style singing he is thought to have the best voice for rnb. That may not be his preferred style but with the vocal coach they gave him that's clearly what they wanted from him.
I never knew there was another person on this track and back in 2014 I didn't know about their individual vocal coaches and just assumed they were all trained equally. But it seems they gave vocalist specific teachers to improve their craft, screw the others I guess
Hearing it in 2024 it's clear the soul and feeling that existed in the 90s in Korea is..like it just doesn't exist anymore. Yoo youngjin is honestly amazing and I am wondering why he isn't like on Rain's level. Like, he's one of the best clearly. He recently left s.m I believe but he should make a fortune as a vocal coach wherever he goes though.
Good training is definitely important, but as a wise woman once said
Honestly there's nothing to explain it there are just some people that are like angels, there voices are out of this world. Yet, sometimes it's not that complex some people just have a knack for music, they create their own special sound and emotion it's incredibly personal they put their soul into what they do.
How s.m teaches...I really think it's similar to what this woman did. Like first time watching it but it's pretty obvious.
I'm not the most articulate person when it comes to singing, but it feels like they try to purposely use this style to create a flavor that may natural come when other artists are singing, but they do it purposely. Everyone in the company is kind of the same, the stop start, belting, quick talk. It leaves a sense of..how am I even sure what happened, no less what the quality of the vocals are. I like to listen to them cover songs in english because I'm able to tell what their natural rhythm is and not 'sm's rhythm for them' this is important because I like to know that outside of their job an artists likes music and sings music. Korean songs are find but I can tell they depend on vocal tricks they learn to get around actually having to master their voice completely like Yoo youngjin did. That takes mastery. Knowing every limit of your voice.
Not every singer can do this but most successful ones definitely can. Even talking should sound like singing. In general sm and extension Exo sing restrained and restricted even when belting so they hardly ever encounter those surprising vocal tone moments when an artist riffs freely.
I try to be fair yet also I want to use a small pool of artists, Exo is male musicians but I'm not talking in terms of vocal range but technique which anyone can learn.
In this one take Haley showcases a bit of her preferred vocal technique. She's able to belt, keep good breath control, project, and keep a consistent yet give emotion and go all the way with her lines without getting outside her vocal range. It takes self knowledge completely.
She actually has a wide range but rarely hits the notes Exo is known for hitting. It's her stability and projection and belting that stands out.
Also a lot of people say kpop is performance is choreography, which is true, but Rockers are known for running around jumping up and down during concerts, similar energy is being exerted. Not exact but very similar.
Early in Justin's career he was going through puberty. A very straining time for a singer because the voice gets deeper and you loose your original tone and possibly range. Many singers work very hard to maintain their voice if you ruin your voice that could be it for life.
In his early 20s honestly he still had a great voice but he also kind of treated his body poorly, more recently he's been trying to improve his health and get used to his older male range. His sound is different but the technique he learned still holds him. The biggest thing I want to show is the importance of being comfortable in your own range it's less about the falsetto's and belting and more a person mastering their own sound and voice.
That's what matters.
I personally in my opinion don't think s.m cares about this and only wants people to adhere to their vocal standard, this is bad for their overall health and will only lead to strained and bruised vocals. Impressing people is not worth declined quality in your natural singing voice.
I think many fans of singers are afraid of them showing their true voice, cracks and bruises and all. Personally for me it's the mark of a weathered person who's lived life. It's genuine, it leaves an impact on people.
apparently this was at drake's hockey party? I don't know a Canada thing, and he performed a private event, there were no official camera's so the person took the audio that was clear from some and tried their best to cut up and splice it like a seamless video. This is the song most people know him for, it's a completely different arrangement and a natural progression. His voice is rough, smooth, his belting is usually projecting a lot. That's the one thing even back in the day nobody could explain his chest voice, it's evident acapella and with the mic. He does lip sync at times but for the most part whenever he sings acapella it sounds the same or better because he has a crisp to his voice that gives it a unique 'texture'. It's like his voice is the instrument. The projection is crazy though particularly when he's outside. I don't want to put a lot of video's but I wish his talent would be studied more than the gossip. He's a very hurt person, but his talent is a wonder. It's unfair people are only appreciated after they are gone. His relationships, gossip and drama many times over shadow his God given abilities.
There's so many good vocal moments..but I have other stuff to talk about, he's just an example here.
I mainly mentioned him because he trained under the same people Exo's songs come from, but he was trained similar to how the oldies where trained..not in a gospel choir like Elvis but very very close
Justin sang worship songs on the street and mimicked mainly that sound as a child and other black artists, he copied them pretty much all day and night. Once you get into it...like it's a rabbit whole you won't believe. I'm just trying to fit a little bit of this circus into an article. Elvis basically was heavily inspired by the black Pentecostal church and in his movie in idk 2022 with Austin Butler you can see just how much black culture had an effect on him. Like people even me didn't understand. He allegedly really had a spiritual experience
there and it changed basically everything about him. Many didn't really like his style and they thought he was too much, too raunchy or whatever. So it took awhile for people to accept what he was doing.
There's a pattern hear somewhere, but it's a lot.
I'm mixing the history with the vocal analysis because it really does overlap, okay back to the black singers from back in the day. So as I was saying, black culture was having a renaissance away from the stereotypical stand up and snap boy groups of the past. Something new was burgeoning, the soulful sensual group that actually danced and walked around. There were so many black boy groups. This could have twelve parts if I go into every way the black entertainment industry has it's grasp on other music industries. And this is just the music, not even talking about the clothes, the hair, the slang, the walk the talk. It's not even making me upset anymore like this is anthropology at this point. So really we should be glad because I've yet to see so much absorption of black culture. Like it was under lockdown and was considered evil and dark for a long time but now it's like people can't get enough. It's honestly interesting.
So one group I always knew about but never went into was Hi-five who have this hit called the kissing game. A super schoolyard song that is like a black community staple. I never thought I'd analyze it or take a deeper look at it because I've been listening to it since childhood.
But looking back at this live performance that they looked like they just walked on stage and are just doing their thing. They seem so casual and calm like singing like that is just normal and anybody could do it. Two members passed away(rest in peace) it's just insane thinking about it. The black community doesn't even think twice about this kind of stuff it's like pretty much everybody has a cousin or two that sings just like this, or an aunt, uncle. It's like nothing. But in other races we praise something we wouldn't praise in our own race cause we'd expect better. Just something to think about.
Like lord, this precious talented child. Like it's funny cause he don't even take it serious and he's playing around. It's nothing to him, the notes he's hitting so many people have to try so hard. The deep bass to the belting, it's like I always wondered why black people belted like they did, I'm not even sure and I haven't found an answer as of yet.
I purposely chose him singing post puberty because him singing at like 11 literally isn't fair he literally sounds like an angel. From what I understand black boys have a long ribcage and large lung capacity, idk there's theories about it.
Also the audience is important ;a lot of acts mainly K-pop will never play anywhere they don't already have fans, the fans are already there. They will even fill the audiences with fans specifically for each filming session for a broadcast, so they can get the chants and avoid a dead crowd.
They were playing at the Apollo, which is a very tough crowd they boo a lot of people. Like black audiences can be notoriously rude so it's always a hit or miss even if people like you. Like idk if anybody ever got jumped but I wouldn't be surprised.
A big part of sm is their extensive trainee process which is supposed to produce global talent. I still wonder what actually is going on, like there are many cases where the people aren't ready or struggle dang near there whole careers to hold a not and dance properly. I really don't understand it. There is also varying things, on one hand some people train for a short time and debut young, so they aren't ready to sing properly and have to learn but then some train for too long of a time and it's treated like that hurt their talent instead of helped it. So there's hardly ever a person that debut's ready to sing, dance and perform with complete comfortability.
Even by the time they have a solo, their is usually little improvement and it may of been better if they debuted as a soloist and been allowed to grow if being in a group would inhibit their growth so much. Yet at the same time their soloist sometimes struggle as well to make a mark and go global.
The main goal of sm is to focus on fandom and pleasing the fans no matter what so they won't have to truly compete on a global level and will be able to fall back on fans support. Which leads to less cultural impact overall. An artist should be apart of everyday life, there music should be known and listened to passingly not because it's all there is. Variety is key, rock, hip hop, rap, pop being staples in American culture gives soul music credence cause people had choices. When the main acceptable thing is one genre and everyone feels inclined to like it to support the culture it leads to less good music. Variety means competition.
also I believe me using the younger but post pubescent versions of these boy groups are fair because I'm trying to get around Exo's vocal range.
It's not a young Justin completely and not an older Justin so I just used two different video's comparing growth.
I used Haley to cover the belting to compare the technique. I struggle putting into words completely so to give a basis I'm using musicians I actually listen to, in order to give a fair explanation on why I feel like for the kings of K pop operating on a global performance level they don't really hit for me. But not just that, also I just like talking about their impact and what made them a group, both good and bad. I really don't like stan culture, like I really don't. I feel like it took defending celebs way too far. I can't even find an honest review anymore. It's turned fans into babies who can't even articulate what they mean anymore. The brains are beyond fried and it's by choice. Simply to fit in and impress the next person.
I always question if I'm on the right path so I listened to Exo in the studio..I-- it's like average modern korean vocals.
Vocal teachers in Korea that actually want the kids to have vocal chords left after 35
Because forcing people to sing out of their range when you can instead let them mature, and marinate is so dumb. All to impress people and to keep up with 15 year old idols it's not smart.
A good example of proper technique is Bang Yedam, his parents are godtier stage parents, with their kid every step of the way. YG didn't make him, he can write good decent music on his own, he knows his worth. He was taught I'm supposing in a similar manner to the western artists. Very smart. He never went out of his range for a group and now he still has his voice and will continue to if he cares for it.
I remember watching this years ago, and I still to this day can't put into words everything I have stated Exo I suppose wasn't taught to do..but that's wrong. What I believe is similar to dance there's a breaking in process. You cannot just wake up one day and sing like Aretha Franklin or Mariah Carrey you must start from childhood and train your vocal chords. Also I'm assuming..it is something people may be born with. Training is apart of it but some have trained for close to almost 20 years and like I'm not finding what I find in the other artists even children/men/women from the Philippines can sing a Beyonce song randomly like I've studied a lot. It may be something unseen. Like who's gonna study this. Nobody really cares.
Anyway concerning Bang Yedam he hasn't sung many western songs post puberty but this cover of thinking bout you where he's barely raising his voice yet implements bass. He switches into chest voice effortlessly. Many mistake head voice for chest, if the neck veins are popping for someone slightly lowering there voice that's head voice. Chest kind of flows out. That's where the belting and heavy flow out of projection comes from. He has definitely at a very young age solidified his own voice
Like if you don't think this is impressive...lord it's like ..this is a talented child for real. Texture is so hard to come by, like he has real texture, he's aware of almost every facet and can bring out emotion like man there's some talented kids in this world. Like, studying the science of it makes it truly more enjoyable for me. The more Iearn it truly helps me understand more about God and how he works, like everybody is truly different and the best part is when a person does what they specifically are made to do. Forcing someone to become someone else, I hate that. Nobody should try to be anyone else but they encourage these kids to do it instead of figuring themselves out
These companies did not make their trainee's. The credit they are given is honestly blasphemous, it irks me. They helped them get famous but I blame any parent who didn't have their child taught outside these companies. They loose confidence, will struggle to become artists and will loose themselves in this industry.
No everyone isn't the same level of talent. With a lot of these people it's not their teaching, it's their knack for it plus genetics and anatomy. This is clear now, because if everyone were capable of singing just like this is kpop they would. His training helped but people have to stop taking away the self appreciation these people have. They are who they are because they were born with a specific set of skills.
I honestly don't think of western artists much when others berate the talent of others and lift some up. I always think about the precious children left behind because their looks aren't as up to par with the beauty standards, or their fanservice isn't as good.
It's sick to be honest. I understand people can like whatever they like but the lies are getting under my skin, false narratives. Certain talent suppressed. Over obsessed fans laughing at those who are actually more talented than their preferred person but they don't have clout or a huge fanbase so what do it matter. Meanwhile the company isn't even concerned with making good music. They just buy whatever sounds decent hire western producers to do most of the work the throw their staff on it to even it out so they seem self sufficient.
I actually feel better doing all this research cause I always go to the ends of the earth to figure out the truth. I wanted to do other things but this was on my heart for awhile.
I have more specific opinions on Exo but.. I don't know if people are ready for that, it's not rude at all but it's..I'm very blunt and do a lot of research so it's so true to me it would be nothing to say but a pain to explain. I will one day but I mainly just wanted to put non exo musicians here because sometimes you need a fresh perspective. Personally I can't imagine listening to kpop as much as most people do, I bet my perception would be messed up as well. I barely knew s.m had a sound or what techniques s.m used and how once you notice it you can hear the shortcomings of all of their singers, how badly they are straining themselves and how unhealthy it is.
I guess that will be another day when I feel like it. I barely do theories anymore like I used to because reality is way stranger than a theory. But this is just something I do for fun so it depends idk I kinda wanna look at some movies or comic books. It depends whatever is least stressful.
End of pt 2.
These longpost are special to me but i'm very opinionated but polite..will put little bits of info for clarification ==Mini Exo fandom analysis pt 1
lmao at people who actually thought the exo vocalists were at Zayn's caliber. Even Zayn "Bradford" Malik
has to work hard to maintain his level of talent, touring is no joke and wears your vocals out that being said you should be able to get a clear grasp on somebody's best and their average
I used zayn cause honestly I am trying to be fair and use a modern example and not people way back in the day. Also I remember this
jk jk. Girl I've never fan voted in my entire life, but I remember this happening though.
But using 1d and using the same standards some Exo supporters use when talking to fans of other kpop group
: do you really think people who aren't true artists of the craft can actually outdo people who can sing a soulful rnb song in their sleep? No, way too much association game being played. Just because s.m entertainment got a leg up from Quincy Jones
and got a bunch of his songwriters and associates and producers
(no this literally isn't even half of it lmao)
to help exo make 'black music'. "Popular music' "We can rock with this music'
Don't mean they are on that level like that. Please note the people that own this music and who own a lot of the music s.m used they all in some way go back to uptown
or motown
In some way, shape or form, because the black music industry was kept separate from the white for a long time, there's a very small crew and circle of people involved in the black music scene. A lot of it has merged into sub labels of larger companies like Universal or Sony. A lot of these songwriters of pretty much indentured and must continue to churn out these 'hits' and it doesn't necessarily matter where in the world it goes so long as it's sold.
They are classically trained singers and can do just as much as a classically trained singer around the world can. But they aren't blowing anyone outside of the average chaebol kid who don't even really care about performing out of the water. S.m taught them well but not nearly well enough for the ego their fans have developed.
Smtown entertainment was built off the foundation of motown, to be the korean version of motown. It's talent is mediocre compared to the original talent the company was based off of, but I suppose compared to the copy of a copy of a copy that exists in Kpop now it's something.
Personally they struggle to outdo Japanese acts artistically as well. In their heyday they created their own genres so unique japanese energy in and of itself was a movement, so I don't understand the superiority.
To be fair Japanese entertainment was on one back in the day from the 80s to early 2000s they ruled even American pop culture
Japan had a longer history with allowing it's citizens and artists freedom of expression, they were able to show out for a good while and gain respect slowly but surely in the international arts realm.
Korea tried to make up for decades of artistic freedom in like a single decade. They are still very rigid with their approach and of course adhere to the strict controlling method of the idol culture model, set by Japan who honestly was way loser even back in the day and even more now.
They critiqued obsessed idol fans back in the day with movies like perfect blue. Of course it still happened but trust when the modern culture shames something and the rest of the world is watching it does effect how people act. Imagine if their was an Hbo show that was about the kpop industry and obsessed kpop fans it definitely would make people tone down. People act differently when people really know what's going on in a situation.
Perfect blue is a mirror to fan culture at it's roots. It's fanatical, a bit unhinged but it's socially acceptable all the same.
A film I believe is necessary for anyone stuck in the idol worship process. It's 'these people don't know you' but artsy.
Even Lee Soo man sent Boa to japan to solidify her career back in the day.
They've had their gender wars, yaoi shotacon era, weird asf eras, religious guilt era, smooth jazz, blues, rap, kawaii, wannabe hood, what's our place in the universe era etc etc as a culture as a society. So their idol industry had a chance to grow slowly, rise up and simmer down naturally. Whereas Kpop just kind of had 20 or so years to boom and the artists have little more growth and development as a disney channel show after 3 seasons.
Boa of course went with the techno chic style that ruled Japan in the early 90s and she did very well.
America however is an entirely different beast, the talent in america is on a different level. Hybrid vigour going 1...2
but that's just a theory. Point is America's a different playground
(I was seven when I first watched her mv on mtv)
this is why most kpop gets their sound from abroad
(Boa's debut single eat you up was made by european producers I guess they were going for a more fusion Backstreet boys style american debut but there is a remix with Flo Rida)
(I may do a breakdown on this later, but it's just the way sm approached the whole thing. They wanted to create an urbanized Boa. That's such a dumb way to go about it. No concern for what actually fit her. That's sm's biggest mistake not letting their artists make their own decisions and be their own people. I watched an interview of her in La back in 2008/9 and she seemed like she was being shuffled around. This producer to that producer, now having to just become a whole new person. It didn't fit. Particularly because she wasn't american, it's not second nature or something she was at all used to.)
For s.m the superiority must be because the korean government is backing them up so they know they cannot fail. Now they feel superior to all of other asian talent and many go to korea to have a chance at becoming globally famous. That's fine.
Even fans of vocal deities don't go around disrespecting everyone like their fans do. Just because they made a point to imitate black singers and use their demos early in their career don't mean they are more elite than anybody else. I never see adele fans do this, it's giving insecurity. You don't have to keep repeating something everybody knows. I feel like as more time goes on the lack of originality is making their remakes more forgettable.
To use a comparison again, in one direction it was almost annoying how obsessed they were about songwriting, they were always in the studio trying to out do one another with the songs they made. Back in the day I thought it was pointless and I felt like Exo was more fun because they focused more on their bond and spending time together.
Now that I'm older it's woven all throughout the music that they had personal deep connections to what they were writing. This is why there are performances where the lyrics actually emotionally effect them, life, death, relationships, breakups, things the fans knew about things we didn't. That's what makes an artist.
Apparently a few members had writing credits on Kokobop and I read about what they said concerning it,
I will say that the group has added to a lot of their songs but I don't believe the craft for songwriting and composing becomes them. In Kpop I noticed many songs created lack a certain spark of life and personal touch
The fine details are also important, this isn't an exposing of the group simply clarification on things that aren't delved into. Many of the songs are remade and have a previous demo.
Knowing the background of the songwriting trio the stereotypes creating hits like Justin Bieber's somebody to love, Tomboy by Destiny Rodgers, Rocketeer by Far East Movement, they have quite a track record and their work is well known. I believe the average fan would give all the credit to Chanyeol because he 'worked on it'.
A very easy thing to find out but when people see an Exo members name on it many ignore anything else about it.
Especially with how they've regarded the black community in general. You truly wouldn't know the impact the black music industry had on kpop or sm unless you were american and it was just obvious to you already, or you researched and figured it out.
I bring this up to say the main compliment I see regarding exo's superior vocals is when members sing high notes and whatnot, which is fine. I love all types of vocals some of my favorite bands of all time is the fray and onerepublic, I purposely mention them because they are grown people music and not for immature 'stans' I hate whenever I bring up an artist that stan culture doesn't like and people bring up streams or who they dated as a drag. It's so immature and petty. So I use them because their music and vocals are not pass out but they are people who have mastered their own voice. It's unique, soulful and not trying to be anybody else. Personally to me this is when I know someone is a true master of their craft whenever they put their soul into their music when they sing.
In my personal opinion I always felt like I couldn't talk years ago, there was no room for oh yeah this artist kind of sings a bit better--if they didn't have stats, weren't popular it didn't matter. Yet, when people in the kpop fandom talked about their favorite artist they were top tier best in the industry and they had the numbers to prove it.
Now years later because the numbers aren't as good as people in the fandom may want it to be; they put other groups or artists down because they aren't real 'singers'. Then show clips of what is love/what if or some other obvious 90s rnb demo or a 90s japanese style pompeii style epic .
I just rarely see commentary about the obvious influences that were used to create the group that Exo's mythos/style/clothing and setup were based off of.
Which they can do because their leader/owner made friends with the right people and opened up a world of connections for them. Because many other groups have been cancelled for jacking theme's and concepts but that never happens with exo because sm owns/CALLS IN FAVORS/ with the media.
So those convo's are never had, so besides the average fanwar, most people can freely live in the world that exo is original and super duper talented above all others. Whenever someone wants to have a convo about this and actually know info about exo and can't just be deemed stupid and uneducated then 'it's not that important'
I tend not to bother or even talk about things that don't really irk me, but I can't lie sometimes I'm a bit irked. The false narratives truly do get to me, I remember a lot of stuff that many fans just weren't there for. I pass in on certain artists every now and then with Exo and Shinee being the only kpop boy groups I really listened to album after album, I keep wondering why I don't randomly get the urge to listen to them.
It could be a lot of reasons, bad memories, or I just am not into them as people. But celeb gossip to me means nothing. I don't care about rumors or someone's bad reputation if their music is good. It's not even the fandom cause some fandoms make me question humanity but when the beat drop I honestly don't really care
With Exo, honestly the music is something I have a hard time returning to. I once agreed with people that it was indeed better than other K-pop but now I'm starting to think that's a poor comparison. We are all equal, maybe not in ability but we all have the ability to put our heart and soul in what we do and if the music is good it should come off as right. There's little excuse when there are kids with youtube channels around the world who sound literally amazing, and they are no different than anybody, just singing to their heart's content. Passion, soul, drive. I believe that will always come off to others. It's what helped the civil rights cause for blacks back in the day, how they sang and danced. People just couldn't believe it.
Now we have an open market for talent so the competition is fierce but there is still people who blow listeners away. Every now and then I'll find a song that's good regardless of the singing style, they could be whispering or just humming and it sounds perfect, because they are doing what's for them.
Kpop is extremely manufactured to the point where this authenticity is very rare, few people truly sing with their heart and soul, it's mainly singing to impress and following a stiff formula. The problem with Exo mainly is the excellent catalogue they had access to, that lee soo man had access to. To me that was their ticket to stardom and a big reason not only for their success but the success of S.m entertainment as a whole. Many fans are less concerned with the details of how their artists and their work came to be and mainly are into the parasocial nature and competitive attitude of fandom for which the overall music and art suffers in my opinion.
The group finds little reason to give content and work very hard on their artistic ventures because honestly, who really cares. It's quite sad and the complete opposite of the music industry decades ago.
So most of the focus is just giving the group a concept, album or good song and the special touch the members give is next to none. The songs and albums could of been for anybody and deep down they know that which may lead to them being disconnected with their music.
Regardless as someone who watched many Untold stories about the black music industry, black artists were done bad, very badly, treated like dirt.
To see their music get new life is bittersweet because of the context in which it's happening, it seems ironic that people who care nothing for the cultural, political or even spiritual reasons for this music existing get to profit off of it. But that's just life. To get back into the talent aspect the singing in general all these years later I can hear now what my young ears couldn't. The vocal technique is mediocre and there is no attempt to fix it
Not only that fans who don't really care about vocal technique are going out of their way to claim not only is Exo superior to Kpop vocals which sure why not, but it's like a disrespectful attitude towards the black musicians and their 'versions'. As in the black musicians talent is ok but it couldn't compare to their Oppa's.
Many in kpop are guilty of this, but heavy is the head that wears the crown even after it's taken off. They are the kings of Kpop, no? Then they are responsible for inspiring the current generation more than anybody. If they are on the wrong path they are only following the example Exo set for them. They have called a lot of attention to their talent but I've yet to see them truly shine brighter than other's on their level. I believe there's a reason they stayed out of America. There is no such thing as constant popularity in the west. They don't just demand showing up and looking good and performing on a basic level. They want everything. Singing, dancing, choreography, artistry, political opinions etc etc.
Artists like Taylor Swift have written a majority of their music whether partially or fully. Hits and misses. It's a learning curve, but improvement is expected in the west. The more personal the better. Haley Williams also writes a majority of her music with her bandmates as well
Haley often talks first hand about her source of inspiration and always goes very deep when creating her music with her team.
constant artistic evolution is never easy there are blips and missteps but the point is an artist is responsible for putting their soul and passion into their work without concern of judgement.
Their hit Ain't it fun was unlike anything they'd done before fit with a gospel choir and all, it wasn't a sure hit but they went for it. A group can be an old group yet still keep it kicking artistically
weird and wacky can definitely work.
To keep going with the boyband contrasts Louis, and the other members, didn't just write one off songs he helped create songs that really had an impact on the group as well. This also helps with creativity because it must be discouraging to an artist to be an artist and have everything handed to them. How can they truly speak.
I put this in here because those boys really did work hard, they had a good run and they truly contributed to the music world despite having the most cookie cutter starting point.
End of Pt one